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tbhavsar
06-23-2008, 02:55 PM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).

mkmmcd
06-26-2008, 05:12 PM
I didn't see your thread, and asked the same question somewhere else. It makes sense to me (but I haven't built a system yet). It seems like it might help with the O2 sensor problems, that people have needed to deal with. I'll be interested in seeing your results.

Phantom240
06-26-2008, 10:56 PM
So you're planning on having the negative plates on one side and the positives on the other side, feeding to different sources?

I don't think that will work well because the plates will be too far apart to conduct sifficient electricity to make much gas.

Stratous
06-26-2008, 11:11 PM
I have seen this done with different designs, I believe I saw a H2 torch set up this way on Youtube, or perhaps a website. If you mix he electrolye strong enough, it should work.

mkmmcd
06-27-2008, 01:09 PM
What if you didn't have an H-shaped generator, but rather placed a barrier between the positive and the negative that would freely allow the electrolyte and electrons to pass, but would hinder the gas bubbles from mixing. Something like a stainless steel screen incorporated as a neutral plate between the + & -? (here is a link to one place that sells ss screen:http://www.directmetals.com ). I think it would be a doable operation...ignorant as I am with no experience (yet) in building my own generator (We just had our 6th child last week, and money is a little tight right now with the bills...:( ).

Stratous
06-27-2008, 02:53 PM
You would have to keep them from mixing inside the open air portion of the elctrolizer. It could be done easily enough I think

mkmmcd
06-27-2008, 03:12 PM
Yes, if the screen had a solid plate at the top, or of the top of the generator had a separator of some kind to keep the gasses separate. I asked this on another part of the forum, but would this help the problem of the O2 sensor detecting too much oxygen causing the computer to enrich the fuel mix? Especially if you were able to route the oxygen so that it didn't enter the system at all?

timetowinarace
06-27-2008, 04:11 PM
I would tend to think that a SS screen would act somewhat as a neutral plate and produce at least some o2 on the hydrogen side of the cell and some hydrogen on the o2 side of the cell. Might be too small an amount to make a difference though.

amwewa66
06-27-2008, 10:09 PM
I have been toying with the same idea and found that it is practical. I have another link that has simular diagram to yours but this was from a chemist.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Separate-Hydrogen-and-Oxygen-from-Water-Through-El/?comments=all

I would like to persue this idea more and would like some one that I can bounce ideas off of. Any takers out there?

tbhavsar
07-06-2008, 03:05 PM
The air around us is about 21 percent oxygen. Almost all the rest is nitrogen, which is inert when it runs through the engine. The oxygen controls how much gasoline an engine can burn. The ratio of gas to oxygen is about 1:14 -- for each gram of gasoline that burns, the engine needs about 14 grams of oxygen. The engine can burn no more gas than the amount of oxygen allows. Any extra fuel would come out of the exhaust pipe unburned.

So if the car used pure oxygen, it would be inhaling 100 percent oxygen instead of 21 percent oxygen, or about five times more oxygen. This would mean that it could burn about five times more fuel. And that would mean about five times more horsepower. So a 100-horsepower engine would become a 500-horsepower engine!

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/oxygen-engine.htm

PAPAFIXIT
07-06-2008, 03:36 PM
That would be one smokin' Honda.

RMForbes
07-09-2008, 07:27 PM
This is possible and is what is done for commercial hydrogen production but it requires higher energy input for a lower output. For our purposes of increasing fuel economy, I believe this would be conterproductive. Wiser people than I have concluded that the reason that HHO works is that it is not only adding fuel to the engine but it also increases the efficiency of the primary fuel combustion. Both H2 and O2 are factors in increasing this efficiency gain. The hydrogen ignites very quickly, up to 12 times faster than the primary fuel and as it burns it ignites the primary fuel from all sides at once. This causes a nearly simultaneous ignition of the primary fuel which allows for much faster more complete burn creating higher pressures and more power. But for this to work properly additional oxygen is needed to combust with both the hydrogen and primary fuel. Without this extra oxygen the hydrogen would consume some of O2 coming from the air intake to combust and would lower the O2 available for combusting the primary fuel and could actually lower the efficiency. Conversely, adding just more oxygen may increase the power output but not the efficiency, more fuel will be added by the engine control computer because it senses unburnt O2 in exhaust.

SmoothCowboy
07-24-2008, 10:52 PM
So could you take that design and adjust the hydrogen to oxygen? Not just eliminating the oxygen available but adjusting it's supply to best suit your situation?

Stratous
07-25-2008, 08:44 AM
The problem with adding more O2 is that the cars ECU senses the extra oxygen and responds by increasing the fuel to the cylinder because it thinks its running lean. The best possible method to control this is by getting a special program for your ECU that compensates for the added "fuels". It could get expensive, but a performance shop that has a dyno tester could do this for you.

hydrotinkerer
09-29-2008, 01:06 PM
I'll have my h2 only gen done by the end of the week. I separated the anode and cathode with a fiberglass barrier. Then I ran separate outlets for o2 and h2.

PAPAFIXIT
09-30-2008, 07:09 PM
I worked on this theory for about 3 very frustrating weeks, I finally realized that when you seperate the H from the O they both rise together. I ultimatly gave up and got drunk.
---------
Life is an ongoing learning process, when we cease to learn we cease to exist.

hydrotinkerer
09-30-2008, 09:24 PM
I worked on this theory for about 3 very frustrating weeks, I finally realized that when you seperate the H from the O they both rise together. I ultimatly gave up and got drunk.
---------
Life is an ongoing learning process, when we cease to learn we cease to exist.

You have to have the divider completely solid at the top to keep h2 and o from mixing together.

coffeeachiever
11-06-2008, 10:10 PM
IMHO, I don't think seperating the gases will trick the O2 sensors. You will still be getting a more complete burn and cleaner exhaust.
Putting pure O2 into your intake was covered in another thread. I believe it was determined that it would increase heat to a dangerous level.
I'm not saying it's not a good idea to seperate the gases, cause I don't know. The guy that reportedly runs his motorcycle off nothing but HHO does it with electromagnets, but he vents off his O2 and doesn't use it at all. He also has had to retard his timing.

It is now 12/23/08 and I have modified my opinion on this. I am beginning experiments on seperating the gasses to see what is possible.

h2gen
12-24-2008, 03:15 AM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).


Yes, the device you are proposing was invented by William Nicholson (1753-1815) - it's a good idea :) A better design is the filter-press electrolyzer invented in the early 1900's, it uses a porous diaphragm between steel plates that lets ions go through but not gas bubbles (usually asbestos cloth, which may be hard to find now).

What you can actually do is supply the air intake with hydrogen, and vent out the oxygen. The main advantage is that using H2 alone will not require you to buy an EFIE and mess around with the oxygen sensor in the electronic injection of your car.
Cheers,
h2gen

Q-Hack!
12-24-2008, 05:15 PM
The air around us is about 21 percent oxygen. Almost all the rest is nitrogen, which is inert when it runs through the engine. The oxygen controls how much gasoline an engine can burn. The ratio of gas to oxygen is about 1:14 -- for each gram of gasoline that burns, the engine needs about 14 grams of oxygen. The engine can burn no more gas than the amount of oxygen allows. Any extra fuel would come out of the exhaust pipe unburned.

So if the car used pure oxygen, it would be inhaling 100 percent oxygen instead of 21 percent oxygen, or about five times more oxygen. This would mean that it could burn about five times more fuel. And that would mean about five times more horsepower. So a 100-horsepower engine would become a 500-horsepower engine!

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/oxygen-engine.htm

Wow! This is so incorrect, it is... wow!

If you were able to get 100% burn on the fuel, you would only see a few percentage points increase in horsepower. Engines are, by there very nature, inefficient beasts. All engines are different, but in general, 80% of the energy is lost as heat 20% goes to the wheels. If you increase the oxygen to burn all the fuel, you still need to account for heat loss. Using your numbers 100-21=79*.2=15.8% increase in horsepower. So, theoretically, a 100 horsepower engine would become a 115.8 horsepower engine.

h2gen
12-27-2008, 11:36 PM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).

You may be interested in this link:
http://peoplesnewenergy.com/home

Still a bit expensive though - hope to see some cheaper (but still as efficient) design out soon, hopefully on ebay!

coffeeachiever
12-28-2008, 01:03 AM
You may be interested in this link:
http://peoplesnewenergy.com/home

Still a bit expensive though - hope to see some cheaper (but still as efficient) design out soon, hopefully on ebay!


That's not efficient. That unit is only producing around 0.375 lpm of HHO. Then when you take out the O2 your only getting about 0.25 lpm of H. Very unimpressive. It's a pretty unit though.

hydrotinkerer
12-28-2008, 03:52 PM
Here is a link to a small cell that separates h from the o. It is used in a small toy car. While small if you could incorporate its positive attributes into a larger unit.

http://store.horizonfuelcell.com/pem-electrolyzersbatch-of-10-uni.html

Someone on another forum has disassembled one so you can see how the inner cell is put together. Startes about reply #36.


http://www.hydroxyhut.com/index.php/topic,152.30.html

coffeeachiever
12-28-2008, 09:46 PM
Here is a link to a small cell that separates h from the o. It is used in a small toy car. While small if you could incorporate its positive attributes into a larger unit.

http://store.horizonfuelcell.com/pem-electrolyzersbatch-of-10-uni.html

Someone on another forum has disassembled one so you can see how the inner cell is put together. Startes about reply #36.


http://www.hydroxyhut.com/index.php/topic,152.30.html

That's pretty neat. I hope the guy does build a large scale version of it. It will certainly be interesting to see how well it works.

coffeeachiever
01-02-2009, 03:03 PM
The first test is very encouraging. As the neomydmium magnets' delivery has been delayed due to the holidays, I went and bought a cheap pair or speakers to get their magnets. These magnets are only 20 oz and not very strong, but I just wanted to see if the theory was plausible. It is.

I disconnected the HHO line from my intake and put it into a 5 gallon bucket of water with a bubbler stone on the end. The small bubbles were coming out so fast the water was churning and I couldn't see sphit. I disconnected all but two of my plates and left four neutrals inbetween. It still bubbled too fast to do anything beneath the surface of the water(at least visibly).

I then halfway submerged the magnets to see what would happen with the bubbles on top. This is where it got a little exciting. Many of the bubbles deviated from their straight path accross the top of the water and curved toward the magnets. Eureka! This just might work!

As of now I don't expect the neodymium magnets in until Monday or Tuesday. I will get everything set up for testing between now and then.

DaneDHorstead
01-02-2009, 04:19 PM
The air around us is about 21 percent oxygen. Almost all the rest is nitrogen, which is inert when it runs through the engine. The oxygen controls how much gasoline an engine can burn. The ratio of gas to oxygen is about 1:14 -- for each gram of gasoline that burns, the engine needs about 14 grams of oxygen. The engine can burn no more gas than the amount of oxygen allows. Any extra fuel would come out of the exhaust pipe unburned.

So if the car used pure oxygen, it would be inhaling 100 percent oxygen instead of 21 percent oxygen, or about five times more oxygen. This would mean that it could burn about five times more fuel. And that would mean about five times more horsepower. So a 100-horsepower engine would become a 500-horsepower engine!

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/oxygen-engine.htm
Tushar;

As I understand it, the hydrogen atom is approx 1/14 the size of the oxygen atom, with a 2:1 proportion in number.....

If a sive (a very fine mesh) is set up, allowing the tiny atoms to pass, but not the larger atoms, limiting the available space for the mixed vapors to accumulate, would force the smaller atoms to pass through the sive,

Perhaps "sive" is not the word to use, but it is a filter of types that does not allow the larger oxygen atoms to pass, but the limited space available would force the smaller, more numerous atoms through it.

I believe you are correct, in the asumption that elimination of the oxygen atoms, will eliminate the need to alter the o2 sensor.... Or will it?

Adding pure hydrogen, will still cause the flame to burn hotter, consuming more of the gasoline mixture. Will the altered oxygen level be changed by adding pure hydrogen?

Perhaps, it will be!

redrat100
02-13-2009, 05:36 PM
This is an interesting thread. Has anyone proven that using only H2 eliminates the need the fool around with an efie/map adjuster?

We use H2 purifiers at work (semi conductor fabrication). I spoke with a rep of the manufacturer, Johnson Matthey. They make an inline O2 removing purifier (see the attached pdf). The smaller ones would fit nicely under the hood of a car. After explaining what I was up to he told me that their filter would not work. It is designed to remove 2 or 3 ppm trace oxygen from 99.999% pure hydrogen in gas cylinders. A purifier to filter out the oxygen from an electrolysis unit would need to be the size of a house.

redrat100
02-13-2009, 05:41 PM
The attachment was too big and did not work last post...

here is the url.

http://www.pureguard.net/html/all_data_sheets_link.html

SmartScarecrow
02-13-2009, 07:48 PM
This is an interesting thread. Has anyone proven that using only H2 eliminates the need the fool around with an efie/map adjuster?

We use H2 purifiers at work (semi conductor fabrication). I spoke with a rep of the manufacturer, Johnson Matthey. They make an inline O2 removing purifier (see the attached pdf). The smaller ones would fit nicely under the hood of a car. After explaining what I was up to he told me that their filter would not work. It is designed to remove 2 or 3 ppm trace oxygen from 99.999% pure hydrogen in gas cylinders. A purifier to filter out the oxygen from an electrolysis unit would need to be the size of a house.


its just my opinion based on observation and I have no science to back it up, but I think fooling around with efie's and such is pretty pointless under any circumstances ...

separating the O's and H's using magnets will sort of work ... you have to do it quickly right after the are split from solution as they will very quickly bond up with other atoms to get stable ... the O's will join up and become O2's and the H's will join up and become H2's ... this makes them electrically and magnetically pretty close to neutral so once they get to that point, you will have a really hard time influencing them even with very strong magnets ...

I have seen a number of designs similar to what folks are calling a "dry cell" that use specially shaped gasket that do a pretty good job of separating the gases right as they get buoyant and start to float off the plates ... the O's are going be forming up on the positive plate and the H's are going to be forming up on the negative plate ...

so if you are really crafty how you shape your gaskets and provide two channels for the gases to follow, you can separate the gases pretty effectively ... it wont be 100%, but close enough for most work ... if you were then planning to compress and store the H2, you would want to run it through a material that had a fast oxidizing material in it, probably a ferrous compound so the oxygen left would have something to bind to and be removed from the hydrogen prior to storage ....

as far as I can tell, the only really, really compelling reason I would want to separate the gases would be for the purpose of compressing and storing ... maybe I make a lot of gas via solar, store it, and burn stored gas after sun down ... something similar to this is being worked on ... there are many who want off the grid and this method shows some promise ... but its not perfect and is indeed less efficient and more costly than just making HHO and burning it as you make it ...

Painless
02-13-2009, 09:27 PM
I am skeptical about separating the gasses to make things easier on the ECU front, I don't think the extra O2 that is being seen is a result of the O we supply along with the H, more the product of more complete combustion lowering the nasties in the exhaust which gets it's place taken by atmosphere.

I did experiment a short while ago with using magnets themselves as the electrodes. Needless to say, the magnets probably wouldn't last in a permanent implementation, however, the interesting point is that if you oriented the poles a certain way ( I can't remember which without digging out my post ) the H and O bubbles were repelled away from each other and away from the electrodes.

SmartScarecrow
02-13-2009, 09:42 PM
I am skeptical about separating the gasses to make things easier on the ECU front, I don't think the extra O2 that is being seen is a result of the O we supply along with the H, more the product of more complete combustion lowering the nasties in the exhaust which gets it's place taken by atmosphere.

I did experiment a short while ago with using magnets themselves as the electrodes. Needless to say, the magnets probably wouldn't last in a permanent implementation, however, the interesting point is that if you oriented the poles a certain way ( I can't remember which without digging out my post ) the H and O bubbles were repelled away from each other and away from the electrodes.

you are correct ... it is not the H2 or the O2 that is having the impact ... it is the lower temperatures in the catalytic converter that is causing the issue most of the time ... that and the change in combustion temperatures ...

as you start inject higher volumes of HHO, the radical ignition advance required for gasoline starts to work against you also ... so many things going on ... most are programming issues ... the fellows doing natural gas and propane automotive conversions already have a great deal of experience with these issues ... we need to look to work they have done to get some of the answers ... the truth is out there ... we just have to know how to find it ...

michog66
02-14-2009, 03:55 AM
would there be a draw back to having that much oxygen?

rboos
01-20-2010, 12:46 AM
would there be a draw back to having that much oxygen?

Rich = Too much gasoline in the mixture = gasoline thru the exhaust pipe$$...
Lean = Too much oxygen in the mixture = higher temperatures = melted engine

There are Air/Fuel controllers (computerized, programmable, fuzzy logic those things) produced by Apexi, Blitz, HKS, and others - that allow you to control the air/fuel ratio and keep the ideal mixture.

The problem is that those equipments trust information (collected by the MAF sensors, O2 sensors - Lambda, exhaust temp sensors, gasoline pressure and flow, vaccuum and pressure lines - resume: ECU data), and even if you insert the recently produced O2 into the air filter (before the mass air flow sensor) it stills lack of the H2 info, and will inject more gasoline too.

Monitor exhaust temperatures when adding O2 alone. In the other hand HHO lowers the exhaust temp, which is good...

tpettit
02-01-2010, 08:20 PM
I have done this for three years with great success.

Roland Jacques
02-02-2010, 10:17 AM
I have done this for three years with great success.

You have done what? details please.

tpettit
02-19-2010, 07:46 PM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).

Contact area must be sufficient for electrolyte to properly conduct power through it. About 80% is a good number.

DieselUser
03-31-2011, 09:46 AM
See hho-research.com.au for details.

slim79
07-17-2011, 10:46 PM
I'm planning on building an hho gen while separating the H & O. I just drew up a rough diagram. The picture is from the top of the generator, with H on the left and O on the right. On the lid I plan to have a separate outlet for the H and one for the O. Letting the O disperse in the air and the H going into the air intake. I've attached a picture of what I plan to build. I have hard plastic separating the Neg and Pos. Anyone have any thoughts or experience with a similar system?

slim79
07-17-2011, 11:38 PM
At the bottom of the jar that I plan to put this in I plan to have about a 1 in to 1/2 in of space at the bottom for the water to flood into the chambers. Does this seem feasible. should I drill small holes in the plastic pieces separating the metal pieces.

myoldyourgold
07-18-2011, 11:50 AM
If I understand your drawing you have 5 plates 3 - and 2 + all in separate compartments but sharing the same electrolyte from the bottom. How are you going to keep the gas separate at the top if that is your goal? You have a parallel connection here so if you are using 12 volts each cell with receive 12 volts and will boil the water/electrolyte in nothing flat. Your idea needs a lot more thought and research.

slim79
07-18-2011, 09:14 PM
ya that was my plan but I'm thinking of changing it for a more simple design. I was thinking about something along this

http://www.fuel-saver.org/Thread-My-H2-Generator-Plans

brandonppr
09-06-2011, 04:38 PM
What if you introduce the HH behind the maf and the O infront of the maf?
This way the fuel goes in and the O is measured.

increasing the O coming into the intake should increase the power you get from the same amount of fuel.
Example 1 ounce of gas pluse 14 ounces of 20% oxygen air should put out less power than 1 ounce of gas pluse 14 ounces of 100% oxygen

Same goes for Hydrogen. Hydrogen + 100% oxygen = more power than Hydrogen and atmosphere air.

myoldyourgold
09-06-2011, 05:38 PM
What if you introduce the HH behind the maf and the O infront of the maf?
This way the fuel goes in and the O is measured.


First you need to understand exactly what the MAF does.

www.autoshop101.com/forms/h34.pdf

It does not make a difference what is in the mix going though the MAF. It just measures the amount drawn into the engine. More going through more gas required, less going through less gas. Now there are more than one type and this is just a simple explanation. Now you can think about that a little and maybe come up with some ideas. Remember the 02 sensor when injecting HHO thinks there is more 0 in the exhaust.


increasing the O coming into the intake should increase the power you get from the same amount of fuel.
Example 1 ounce of gas pluse 14 ounces of 20% oxygen air should put out less power than 1 ounce of gas pluse 14 ounces of 100% oxygen

Same goes for Hydrogen. Hydrogen + 100% oxygen = more power than Hydrogen and atmosphere air.

There is slightly more HP but the 02 sensor still sees to much O. Why isn't the 0 completely used up when you inject HHO? Some tests show that the O is consumed more when the O and H2 are injected in different positions in the intake stream after the MAF. This makes no sense but seems to be the case based on tests I and others have done. I have no explanation though. The same can be said about why the 02 thinks there is more O. The only thing I can think of is that it is a ratio of O to other gases which are less making the O seam more. This ratio must change then when injecting the O and H2 in different spots too but in the opposite way. I have no way of proving this maybe others have more on this.

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:14 PM
Hi everyone my name is bruno and I build dry cells that direct split
water into hydrogen and oxygen totally separated
come and visit my forum to find all about the separator cell

http://www.hydrogenpower.be/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=20#p98

http://www.hydrogenpower.be/images/mijn%20afbeeldingen/the%20separator%20cell/8%20the%20separator%20cell.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:15 PM
here is how the cell is put together
http://www.hydrogenpower.be/images/mijn%20afbeeldingen/the%20separator%20cell/cell%20opstelling%20separator%20cell.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:17 PM
this is a active plate
http://www.hydrogenpower.be/images/mijn%20afbeeldingen/the%20separator%20cell/1%20active%20plaat%20+%20of%20-.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:19 PM
so this is the form off the membranes

the membranes are made off simple nylon fabric
as fine and as dence as posssible

http://www.hydrogenpower.be/images/mijn%20afbeeldingen/the%20separator%20cell/3%20gasket%20membrane.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:23 PM
here is a pic on how the gaskets are cut
from neopreen rubber
http://www.hydrogenpower.be/images/mijn%20afbeeldingen/the%20separator%20cell/5%20gasket.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:25 PM
here is a video on how the cell runs

http://www.hydrogenpower.be/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=20&start=10#p211

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-11-2011, 01:29 PM
here is a video with proof that I am making only Hydrogen
the balloon just pops and not explodes

http://www.hydrogenpower.be/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=20&start=10#p209

www.hydrogenpower.be
08-10-2012, 03:18 AM
hi everyone

my again ,so I still wanted to get my cell working

without any catalist so no KOH or somthing else

wel the law says you gonna need to overcome

a magnetic feeld that there is holding the 2 parts off hydrogen and 1 part

off oxygen together

so you gonna need to apply a electrical magnetic feeld to the h2o

caled electrolisation

only problem is h2o out off its one does not conduct electricity

so normaly to make it easy we apply some KOH

and there we have it

a cell that runs hot ,does not produce enough , after a while dont

produce at all any more ,so all kinds off problems related to

making the water better conduct electricity

now when they first started to do electrolesys back in 1600

they did not have 12 volt like we do now before tesla there was no AC

so it was very difficoult to make a specific DC voltage

they used High voltage beceause for them it was easy to come by

most sources did this standard

so they used a voltage like 2000 v DC

now these days that has become a difficoult voltage to come by

butt I did it anyway so here is a scematic for a 2250 volt DC

powersurply that will give you 10 amps

not milliamps but AMPS

now there is one more thing when using High voltage there is mostly no

high current so you can split the water just by a few amps and won't

need big amps


http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb197/riddicksworld/_DSC6635.jpg


http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb197/riddicksworld/_DSC6638.jpg


http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb197/riddicksworld/_DSC6640.jpg


http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb197/riddicksworld/_DSC6636.jpg

www.hydrogenpower.be
08-11-2012, 05:36 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zapyD_sjIDM

www.hydrogenpower.be
09-16-2012, 11:04 PM
question

if I am making hho and i separate them or make them separate at ones

and there is only tap water in it

there is gonne be chlorine in it

on witch side the O or the H2 side is gonna come chlorine dioxide

Madsceintist
09-17-2012, 06:42 PM
My theory is that it would if at all be produced on the hydrogen side. But that I would only guess at since I would think it may be heavy enough to stay in the water aspect and become a solid waste .?

Nadasive
02-13-2013, 04:44 PM
hi everyone

my again ,so I still wanted to get my cell working

without any catalist so no KOH or somthing else

wel the law says you gonna need to overcome

a magnetic feeld that there is holding the 2 parts off hydrogen and 1 part

off oxygen together

so you gonna need to apply a electrical magnetic feeld to the h2o

caled electrolisation

only problem is h2o out off its one does not conduct electricity

so normaly to make it easy we apply some KOH

and there we have it

a cell that runs hot ,does not produce enough , after a while dont

produce at all any more ,so all kinds off problems related to

making the water better conduct electricity

now when they first started to do electrolesys back in 1600

they did not have 12 volt like we do now before tesla there was no AC

so it was very difficoult to make a specific DC voltage

they used High voltage beceause for them it was easy to come by

most sources did this standard

so they used a voltage like 2000 v DC

now these days that has become a difficoult voltage to come by

butt I did it anyway so here is a scematic for a 2250 volt DC

powersurply that will give you 10 amps

not milliamps but AMPS

now there is one more thing when using High voltage there is mostly no

high current so you can split the water just by a few amps and won't

need big amps

[/img]


sooo from what I can understand from this post, you've created this thing that changes 12vDC to 2250vDC?????

Akito
02-13-2013, 06:32 PM
correct the dielectric strength of water is high but all things have limit. Gaining enough voltage you can probably split water without an electrolyte.

Look into tesla coils. They wireless power things all the time and produce high voltage from low voltage supplies.

good luck

Nadasive
02-19-2013, 04:08 PM
correct the dielectric strength of water is high but all things have limit. Gaining enough voltage you can probably split water without an electrolyte.

Look into tesla coils. They wireless power things all the time and produce high voltage from low voltage supplies.

good luck


Yes but how the hell do you retrofit one for a car? :confused:

pulsethunder01
06-20-2013, 05:40 AM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).
Wouldn't want to make things too complicated rather, I would much rather prefer simplicity for sake of practical matters but, out of curiosity... has anyone ever thought of building a "Gas Centrifuge"? its complicated in design... but I'm sure its practical in function, Having some physics background myself, with all sorts of fluidynamic projects, I can see this going somewhere. aside from a hydrogen ceramic membrane to separate hydrogen with a centrifuge forcing oxygen to filter out.

TimCollins
09-17-2013, 01:46 AM
This looks like an old post but i posed a question about how to do this here: http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?8346-Seperating-Hydrogen-and-Oxygen
It is an idea I have but have not tested... Is anyone still working on how to seperate the gasses?

wangsamax
04-04-2014, 04:27 AM
I am thinking about separating Hydrogen and Oxygen using an ‘H’ shape PVC Pipe housing (please click on attached drawing); the idea is to pass Oxygen only to the Air/Filter Intake and Hydrogen to Engine. I would like to ask experts, will this make any positive improvements compare to passing both together (HHO gas).

the idea will work but not producing H & O fast because the gap is very far.
I already did make new design for separate H & O. pls see this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sf8h6_JzqVk and give your comment

Balam
07-11-2015, 12:18 PM
So if the car used pure oxygen, it would be inhaling 100 percent oxygen instead of 21 percent oxygen, or about five times more oxygen. This would mean that it could burn about five times more fuel. And that would mean about five times more horsepower. So a 100-horsepower engine would become a 500-horsepower engine!



This is the principle behind why cars have more hp at sea level and slowly diminish when altitude rises. But could this numbers (100hp to 500hp by changing 21% O to 100% O), be real?

Balam
07-11-2015, 12:24 PM
The problem with adding more O2 is that the cars ECU senses the extra oxygen and responds by increasing the fuel to the cylinder because it thinks its running lean. The best possible method to control this is by getting a special program for your ECU that compensates for the added "fuels". It could get expensive, but a performance shop that has a dyno tester could do this for you.

Couldn`t you just tap the wire of the o2 sensor, find out the normal running voltage, the Oxygen enriched voltage, and simply feed the ecu a fixed voltage reading?

jesusangel
07-23-2015, 04:18 PM
There is no normal running voltage, it fluctuates depending on oxygen levels, so you can't set a fix voltage, the same for map/maf sensors, but the way oxygen sensor is designed make easy to use an extender so the sensor read less oxygen compensating the excess.

https://www.google.es/search?q=hho+oxygen+sensor+enhancer&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=667&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMIv-rz3IfyxgIVgoI-Ch2aOwkE#tbm=isch&q=hho+oxygen+sensor+extender.

Regards

RustyLugNut
07-28-2015, 03:32 PM
This is the principle behind why cars have more hp at sea level and slowly diminish when altitude rises. But could this numbers (100hp to 500hp by changing 21% O to 100% O), be real?

The more oxygen you have, the more fuel you can oxidize. 100% O2 and fuel has been tested in the past. The only problem is the much higher heat involved. Specialty materials such as ceramic pistons and cylinders are needed to survive any length of time.

DrFission
10-04-2015, 07:51 AM
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