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you2wire
07-10-2008, 08:58 PM
Ok
I am in the process of create my HHO cell, but before i starting working on it on the weekend and wanted to map out some designs i though would work. attached are 5 designs that i created but i not shure they will work based on the principal of making HHO gas they should but you never know until you actaul make it.

My question is based on my 5 design which one do you think will perform the best.

I have already bought the the stainless steel plates which are actually switch covers from lowes and other parts.

Parts list

(18) stainless steel switch cover - 4.5in X 2.5 ins
(2) 4in PVC pipe - 1ft long
all the reducers

The Red indicates Positive
The Black indicates Negative

dennis13030
07-10-2008, 11:11 PM
The first two are good because there is room for more water above the plates. The last one is nice because there is more plates.

Given this choices, I would select the last one.

All of these designs may have a heat problem. You may need to put 3 neutral plates between each pair of POS/NEG plates.

Also, NICE DRAWINGS!

Stratous
07-10-2008, 11:18 PM
on the last drawing, i would only put 2 "N" plates between if your planning to run in series. 3 if going parallel

rmptr
07-10-2008, 11:19 PM
If you go with the Smack style electrical connection you'll worry less about liquid leaks.

Best

you2wire
07-11-2008, 07:59 AM
Please can you explain more about this Neutral Plate.
I am guesting that the neutral plate is conected to neither + or - plates is free standing but why?

Neutral Plate suggestion would be if I started from the outside -+-N+-+ N +-+N-+- (last design) would this work.

The last design has 2 cell systems that i will put in a 1/2' plexi glass box customer made. I was thinking it would in a box that would be 12'L X 8'W X 10H.

I will redraw the design with the Neutral plate and also design a Bubbler and tell me if it would work.

NOTE: I have never done this before i have no electrical or engineering background. I just like the concept of HHO

you2wire
07-11-2008, 10:51 AM
As promised here is the update design with the Neutral Plate

dennis13030
07-11-2008, 11:02 AM
You are getting closer.

"+" represents an anode, connection to the positive terminal of the battery.
"-" represents a cathode, connection to the negative terminal of the battery.
"N" or "n" represents a neutral, is not connected to the battery but sits in between an anode and cathode.

Try one of these configurations

+NNNN- and -NNNN+
or
+NNN-NNN+NNN-
or
+NN-NN+NN-NN+

cougar gt-e
07-11-2008, 11:14 AM
SO, can someone explain what the "N" plates are doing? Is there any gass from them? If so --> why so?

Please don't direct me to a utube video as my dial up connection just can't take it.

Stratous
07-11-2008, 11:19 AM
You should read these post, it will help understand nuetral plates.

http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?t=195&highlight=nuetral
http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?t=205&highlight=nuetral
http://www.hhoforums.com/showthread.php?t=266&highlight=nuetral

There are alot more post that talk about N plates, do a search and it will reveal a ton of information.

dennis13030
07-11-2008, 11:20 AM
I do not fully understand how the netural plates work. However, I think what they do is divide the total charge among the newly formed number of cells. There seems to be a reaction curve associated with the current through a single cell. This reaction curve is similar to a voltage-current curve of a diode. With a diode(or cell), as voltage increases there is initially very little current until the voltage reaches a threshold then current increases very rapidly. The biggest differences between a diode and a cell are;

1. Where the threshold is(diode=0.7V, cell=approximately 2.0V).
2. How broad the curve is near the thresholds(diode=sharp curve, cell=broad curve).
3. A diode blocks current in the reverse direction. A cell does not.

So lets say you start with two plates and 12V. You should be getting lots of current and heat and a fair amount of gas production. Next, you insert 3 neutral plates in between the original plates. Now You should be getting much less current and heat and about the same amount of gas production.

you2wire
07-11-2008, 11:38 AM
Ok here is the latest and greatest update. Does this make any sense now. I want to start the project tomorrow so i am in the final stages.

Tell me your thoughts

Stratous
07-11-2008, 11:52 AM
Ok here is the latest and greatest update. Does this make any sense now. I want to start the project tomorrow so i am in the final stages.

Tell me your thoughts

Are you going to run those cells in paralles or series? If series, then you should remove a few N plates from each cell. If parallel then it should be ok.

Two cells in series will = 6v on each cell. 5 N plates will drop about 7v on each cell. I would go no more than 2 n plates on a series cell.

Parallel cells will have 12v on each cell so the 5 plates wont hurt.

You can try both and see which one works better. personally I like series cells.

cougar gt-e
07-11-2008, 12:30 PM
Stratous,

Thanks for the links.

I've read them. Still foggy, but that may be just my max limit of knowledge for the day has been reached....

Dennis,

Huh? I only caught about every 3rd word. The last bit made sense.

thanks

Packer Fan

you2wire
07-11-2008, 01:12 PM
I Made some adjustments to the design

which would make more Hydrogen V2 or V2.1

dennis13030
07-11-2008, 01:21 PM
I like this design. Just be careful about the heat and current draw.

you2wire
07-11-2008, 01:52 PM
Dennis
Sorry for making so many changes to the design. I will be making two HHO cells this weekend the new version will be in a 1ft by 4in PVC pipe .

Tell what you think ?

Again thanks alot for the insight

dennis13030
07-11-2008, 02:58 PM
I like it. Good job!

you2wire
07-12-2008, 01:51 PM
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/hho-cell

Live feeb of me making my cell - for the next 2 hours

mario brito
07-12-2008, 03:08 PM
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/hho-cell

Live feeb of me making my cell - for the next 2 hours

NOW I'M REALLY SURPRISED !!!!

live feed on HHO Cell building ! that's a nice ! i'm whatching (spelling ?) right now :)

great mess, but fun to watch and listen to ! :)

Smith03Jetta
07-12-2008, 06:03 PM
The live feed thing is a great idea. In the future, can we publish the On-Air Date, Time, TIME ZONE ahead of time so we can plan to watch?

dennis13030
07-12-2008, 08:12 PM
Wow. Thats so cool...... please schedule them, I will watch.

mario brito
07-12-2008, 09:36 PM
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/hho-cell

Live feeb of me making my cell - for the next 2 hours

once again, thanks for all the pacience you had with me on your live feed !

its great to find a place where people take their own time to show their ideas, results, etc ! it was very instructing !

i believe that with this level of sharing, we can all get good results ! :) :)

thanks

you2wire
07-13-2008, 05:06 PM
I was great having Chris, Dennis and Mario Live between yesterday and today helping me with my HHo Cell. I was able to finish 2 cells 10 plates today.

Based on Dennis recommendation i am going to make this cell 30 Plates and see what happens so i have 20 more to make. WOW

Attached is my design plan. please can you advise if this can work, I will put it in a 18ins X 4ins PVC Pipe.

Stratous
07-13-2008, 08:18 PM
I was great having Chris, Dennis and Mario Live between yesterday and today helping me with my HHo Cell. I was able to finish 2 cells 10 plates today.

Based on Dennis recommendation i am going to make this cell 30 Plates and see what happens so i have 20 more to make. WOW

Attached is my design plan. please can you advise if this can work, I will put it in a 18ins X 4ins PVC Pipe.

How are you going to wire them? The second diagram is a 4" pipe? I dont believe its all going to fit. Other than that, it looks good.

you2wire
07-13-2008, 10:19 PM
Stratous
The top view design - The plate are 2.5in wide and 4.5long the long side goes down in the PVC pipe and 2.5in wide section will go across, not much space but they fit.

On the out side the cell i was going to connect(strap) them + to + and - to -

jimbo40
07-13-2008, 10:45 PM
I hate to be stupid, and your illistrations are very nice, but in the first drawings your calling the - or cathode nuetral, And I think the grey would be nuetral and the black neg or - or cathode. what am I missing?

And then you show the anode rod or pos going through some plates and not others, so are they making contact or not?
Can't you label the plates as + for positive - for negative and nuetral?
Because Like I said I hate to be stupid but I'm not catching something.
Thanks
Jim

mario brito
07-13-2008, 10:46 PM
Stratous
The top view design - The plate are 2.5in wide and 4.5long the long side goes down in the PVC pipe and 2.5in wide section will go across, not much space but they fit.

On the out side the cell i was going to connect(strap) them + to + and - to -

hi :)

a few questions :

how do you do so good drawings ? it's great to see your ideas in such a clear way ! what software are you using ?

on your first image, i can see that your going to put 2 sets of plates on top of the other 2 ( not toutching ). the flow of H+O bubbles going up isn't going to interfere with the production on the top plates ?

thanks

you2wire
07-13-2008, 11:09 PM
I use Visio to make these drawings.

Sorry for the mistake

The Red is Postive
The Black is Negative
The Grey are the Neutral Plates

In the Design the Neutral plates are not connected to anthing ( not illustrated in the design) There holes in the Neutral plate so the done touch.

I hope flow of H+O bubbles going up isn't going to interfere with the production on the top plates once i finish it i tell you.

jimbo40
07-13-2008, 11:18 PM
Thanks much. now it makes sense.
I know how much time you must have put in this, but for all of us,
Is there any chance you and visio could whip up a rendering of that 2 cell one with all the plates labeled, they look like one I want to build.
If not thanks anyway and I'll use the current drawings.

dennis13030
07-13-2008, 11:22 PM
There is a theory that has been discussed concerning electrodes placed in a vertical form. The theory is that; the flow of water and gasses inside an electrolyzer using a vertical electrodes arrangement will produce a little more HHO gas because the flow of the water replaces the "cracked" water quickly and helps in pushing bubble formations off the electrodes. The water is pushed upward with the bubbles, travels down the side-walls of the container and up into the bottom of the electrodes.

I think this theory may be true.

countryboy18
07-15-2008, 08:43 PM
that is one SICK looking cell if i only had a unlimited supply of plates i would make like a wall of cells. like a bank of scuba tanks in the dive shop. o man that would be a jaw droping experence. that was i great thing to go to sleep in my head. i love HHO!!!

countryboy18
07-15-2008, 10:51 PM
can you post the video of the cell. or some pics of it. please we are dieing to see it finished.