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View Full Version : My First Gen, which one to go with? [i DONT want to touch the ECU or sensors]



slimk
07-22-2008, 03:59 PM
The biggest determining factor is that i DONT want to have to play around with the computer, sensors, or anything like that [at least for this early stage of my project]

I want something that will give me the best initial MPG results without having the ecu and map/o2 sensors robbing me of MPG the second i get a gain.

I'm doing this on a STOCK 1994 Saturn SW2 Wagon [Twin Cam], i want your opinions.

so far im thinking doing a hoffman style [it separates the H and O so i can choose to only intake the H] gen but the biggest issue is LOW LPM production, likely around .15-.35/lpm, in which case im considering maybe making TWO of them in series so that i can at least try to get .50-.60/lpm of pure hydrogen.

the other thing is to try a smack booster and just try to turn out as much lpm as possible and hope that it can deal with the sensors and give me at least some MPG gain right off the bat.

i guess another issue is what will have a better overall effect, pure hydrogen, or the HHO mix? i dont care if i get only modest MPG gains initially but i want SOME gains FAST, without having to learn how the ECU works.

thanks for your input! :cool:

ridelong
07-22-2008, 04:18 PM
Slimk,
Man, that is the thousand dollar question.

About the only thing anyone can do is tell you what they did, and the results.

I have a 2003 Ranger 2.3 liter.

Built a 1 quart gen. used 2 sets of 6, +nnnn-, Plates are 0.030 inch thick, 4.5 high X 2.5 wide. Plate spacing is 0.067 inch.

Used 30 oz of distilled water with 1/4 tsp of potassium hydroxide. No bubbler, a catch cup and a check valve at the intake snorkel.

Running between 4.4 to 5.5 amps, no modifications to the electronics, I got 37.5% increase. Went from 22.4 to 30.8 mpg.

slimk
07-22-2008, 05:48 PM
wow thats amazing!

-what material did you make the gen housing out of?
-do you know how 0.030 inch thick compares in "gauge" numbers, like 18 gauge or something?
-how maybe versions of the gen did you have to make or how many tweaks till you got it working this well? did you experiment a lot with plate spacing?
-do you know your lpm?

i guess this goes to show that even relitively new vehicles can still be ok with HHO, without touching the electronics, but it seems few and far between, and also it seems bigger vehicles tend to do better, like suv's and pickups...

ridelong
07-22-2008, 07:58 PM
Slimk,
I used a quart jar from McMaster Carr.

Plates are 22 Ga..

Went through about 7 iterations, and I'm not done yet. Lucked out on the spacing, never changed it.

In my basement it generates about 0.3 liters per minute at 14.3 volts

Put one in my friends honda this afternoon. He wanted to try it in the downstream side of the butterfly. So we did. HOLY CRAP! That thing generated 5 times what mine did with the same generator. I am VERY excited and can't wait to see his milage. Initially so much violent flow through the bubbler it sent water into the intake making the #4 cylinder misfire. We finally took all water out of the bubbler and added an extra empty bubbler to catch any stuff that the first one passed. It was nuts.

EltonBrandd
07-22-2008, 08:20 PM
Slimk,
I used a quart jar from McMaster Carr.

Plates are 22 Ga..

Went through about 7 iterations, and I'm not done yet. Lucked out on the spacing, never changed it.

In my basement it generates about 0.3 liters per minute at 14.3 volts

Put one in my friends honda this afternoon. He wanted to try it in the downstream side of the butterfly. So we did. HOLY CRAP! That thing generated 5 times what mine did with the same generator. I am VERY excited and can't wait to see his milage. Initially so much violent flow through the bubbler it sent water into the intake making the #4 cylinder misfire. We finally took all water out of the bubbler and added an extra empty bubbler to catch any stuff that the first one passed. It was nuts.

if you hooked it up past the "butterfly" then you tapped in to manifold vacuum. The generator didn't produce anymore than it did on your car. The difference was you are applying 21 inches of vacuum and the cell is percolating violently now. You should be very careful about letting water get in to the combustion chambers. A little known fact is that when enough water gets in to the combustion chamber at one time the piston comes up and the water in chamber can not be compressed. The weakest point is the connecting rod, and then the rod makes a 90 degree turn right through the block.

scottyhho
07-22-2008, 09:07 PM
I'm getting ready to put my system in this weekend. we've been working on it for a while now. i am going to put extenders on my O2 sensors right off the bat. it's real easy to do and it seems like that's the best way to get any boost:

ridelong
07-23-2008, 09:08 AM
Eltonbrandd,

We added 2 catch cups to the system, and removed a few oz of electrolyte from the generator. Ran the car for about 6 miles. Nothing in either cup.

Generator still putting out lots of gas.

The water that got into the engine was only a few drops, but enough to throw out an OBD2 misfire code. In my excitement I may of overstated the situation.

ridelong
07-29-2008, 06:10 PM
I hooked my HHO to the intake manifold. Started the truck without the HHO bottle energized. The electrolyte didn't bubble at all without power applied. If the vacuum caused the electrolyte to boil, I would expect it to happen without power applied.

When power is applied, the gas generation is amazing.

Have been running this way for 3 days. Looks promising. Will post at fill up.