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View Full Version : KOH VS. Baking Soda, etc.



HHOhoper
07-30-2008, 03:58 AM
I've heard that KOH is by far the best choice for electrolytes due to it's performance. I went and tested my dad's cells. He has two cells in series totaling 7 amp draw and putting out a sad liter per 8 minutes and at 135 degrees. The best I've done on mine is one liter per 5 minutes at 17 amps and 120 degrees.
I'm telling him that I've heard that KOH is the best only because of what others say, but I personally don't have any experience. I know it's toxic, but does it corrode engine parts like some say?

Will KOH provide more production than baking soda at a lower temp and lower amp draw?

What are all the downsides to KOH that you can possibly think of?

jazmie
07-30-2008, 07:26 AM
im not so clever in chemistry,can i know KOH similar item that we can buy that we use daily like?

ridelong
07-30-2008, 10:27 AM
I tested baking soda, sodiun hydroxide. and potassium hydroxide.

Potassium hydroxide is by far the best. The reason is rust or crud generation.
Baking soda is worst, changing electrolyte every 2 days. Sodium hydroxide is better, changing electrolyte about every 5 days. Potassium hydroxide, has barely any generation of crud. It has been weeks and I only have to add distilled water.

It does not harm your engine because it stays in the electrolyte. When the water is used the electrolyte gets stronger because the potassium hydroxide stays in the electrolyte. I've only added distilled water to my HHO generator for weeks.

Potassium hydroxide is caustic, and the crystals are dangerous, so care should be taken when using it.

Potassium hydroxide can be bought on ebay or AAA chemicals.

HHOhoper
07-30-2008, 03:39 PM
I tested baking soda, sodiun hydroxide. and potassium hydroxide.

Potassium hydroxide is by far the best. The reason is rust or crud generation.
Baking soda is worst, changing electrolyte every 2 days. Sodium hydroxide is better, changing electrolyte about every 5 days. Potassium hydroxide, has barely any generation of crud. It has been weeks and I only have to add distilled water.

It does not harm your engine because it stays in the electrolyte. When the water is used the electrolyte gets stronger because the potassium hydroxide stays in the electrolyte. I've only added distilled water to my HHO generator for weeks.

Potassium hydroxide is caustic, and the crystals are dangerous, so care should be taken when using it.

Potassium hydroxide can be bought on ebay or AAA chemicals.

That is VERY helpful information; thank you! Now can anyone provide information about how Potassium Hydroxide, Sodium Hydroxide, and Baking Soda all compare when it comes to comparing hydrogen generation against how much heat is generated and how many amps are required?

For example: If you were to conduct an experiement using all three electrolytes and you adjust each to only put out 500ml per minute. How hot would each get and how many amps would each draw?

ridelong
07-30-2008, 08:51 PM
HHOhoper,

I never did any metered tests comparing the 3 chemicals. But my general observation is that they were close to being the same for a given power level.

Potassium hydroxide is SO much better because you can run for weeks , and only add distilled water to top it off as the generator uses it. I actually don't know how long it can run without changing, because I haven't had to, and it's been weeks. The crystals are caustic so be carefull with them.

Baking soda sucks worst, in 2 days I can't see the electrodes, and have to pull the generator out of the car, dump it in the sink, and make new electrolyte, then put it back in the car.

HHOhoper
07-30-2008, 09:05 PM
So is the only advantage to KOH, the cleanliness of it in a cell?

computerclinic
07-30-2008, 09:35 PM
It is clean...but another important benifit is that you only need to add more distilled water to your generator instead of dumping-rinsing-refilling every few weeks or even less.

Water will evaporate and otherwise make its way to the bubbler and into the air, but the KOH sticks around in the genny. Just add water:)

Other agents such as salt, will create an additional and undesirable byproduct(s).

HYDROTEKPRO
07-30-2008, 11:24 PM
Yeah, we heard the same thing from many sources. So in all our testing we've only used KOH so far. They even use it with NASA so it must be good, right?:p The ideal percentage just may be different under the hood, than in outer space with the ultra-exotic polymers (like those in the PEEK group) and those rare, high performance metals that always get used in space.

NaOH (Sodium Hydroxide) is probably a VERY close 2nd place. Smack recommends it since it's so easy to get from hardware stores and especially LOWES, in the form of Lye or drain cleaner.

It probably stays in the electrolyzer like KOH is supposed to, but we'll know for sure when all our testing is done in about a month or so!

oscarT
04-13-2009, 11:27 PM
I have a query

I have a 3500cc, i 've installed a unit using the KOH but it is not working. in the begining i start with 2-1/2 teaspoons of koh in 1700ml and the Amp reading were 0.06Amp therefore I put 20 teaspoons and the reading is still the same. the relay show a reading of +20Amp so

Can someone tell me if the 20 teaspoons are not enought for the 1700ml. i am looking for atleast 12Amp in my unit

Thank you

truckman1966
04-28-2009, 03:43 PM
from everything i have read about NaOH and KOH, that was way too much to start with and using more actually reduces production. if i have read everything correctly. :)

truckman1966
04-28-2009, 04:29 PM
I just tested my unit on NaOH. 1/2 tsp. for 1 Gal water. seems just as productive as the baking soda. and it cleaned even more brown crap off of the plates.

WFCollective
05-05-2009, 02:11 AM
try starting with 25% sodium hydroxide solution. It gets hot, so be careful. Never add water to powdered lye- mix in a little lye to the water- measure w/ ohmeter, lower resistance is better. good luck!

cabrera
07-19-2009, 10:41 PM
I tested baking soda, sodiun hydroxide. and potassium hydroxide.

Potassium hydroxide is by far the best. The reason is rust or crud generation.
Baking soda is worst, changing electrolyte every 2 days. Sodium hydroxide is better, changing electrolyte about every 5 days. Potassium hydroxide, has barely any generation of crud. It has been weeks and I only have to add distilled water.



Now are you talking about Potassium Hydroxide Flakes or Potassium Hydroxide Lab Grade?

Q-Hack!
07-20-2009, 07:50 AM
try starting with 25% sodium hydroxide solution. It gets hot, so be careful. Never add water to powdered lye- mix in a little lye to the water- measure w/ ohmeter, lower resistance is better. good luck!

I am going to counter this claim (to a point)...

Yes the higher concentration produces more HHO than a lower concentration. However unless you live in a freezing cold climate then there is no reason to go this high. The amount you gain in production is outweighed by the danger of ever spilling it on you.

Also, the 25% by weight only applies to those who have PWM's. If you are just going brute force then your concentration is only going to be, at most 4-5 Tbls. per gallon of water. If you are using a PWM then you don't need more than 10-12 Tbls per gallon, anything more is just a waste of resources.

HHOCHL
07-22-2009, 07:23 PM
Hi folks

Cool discussions!

For about half a year I'm experimenting with KOH in wet and now in dry cell.
Both with 316L plates, if this means quality.

Unfortunately after some 200 miles one third of the wet cell is filled up with a corrosion like pudding. Really ugly.
Normally I use a potassium alkaline 50% solution and mix it up in relation 1:2000 with distilled water. Production rate is good, but very fast corrosion occurs.

Now with the dry cell I'm trying tabwater. Even so corrosion appears after some 20 miles at the bottom of the cell. See the pic. http://www.hhoforums.com/images/smilies/confused.gif

Did somebody make the same experiences?

soda_pop503
07-28-2009, 11:04 PM
I have a query

I have a 3500cc, i 've installed a unit using the KOH but it is not working. in the begining i start with 2-1/2 teaspoons of koh in 1700ml and the Amp reading were 0.06Amp therefore I put 20 teaspoons and the reading is still the same. the relay show a reading of +20Amp so

Can someone tell me if the 20 teaspoons are not enought for the 1700ml. i am looking for atleast 12Amp in my unit

Thank you

It sounds like you could have some sort of electrical issue as well.

What kind of cell do you have?

PiTRiFF
08-12-2009, 03:56 PM
What would be the appropriate amount to add to a 1qt cell?