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Costahho
08-02-2012, 02:45 PM
Hello
I am new to the forum and am in costa rica , planning on running an 11 plate dry cell unit in my diesel prado with the 1kz-te engine , with research i cannot find an o2 sensor or map sensor . i have read about a chip for the ecu they sell in australia to boost hp. This chip modifies the signal to the injector pump to gain horsepower and claims that the 1kz-te engine does not have a closed loop o2 sensor to adjust their modifications made by their chip. i figure it would work the same with the addition of hho? may i be lucky to not have to make an EFIE or MAP adjustments?

Also this engine has an aluminum head and with the added combustion from the hho i am a little afraid of damage.
should i be worried of this ?
I truly belive this will work but am still new to this.


Thanks

myoldyourgold
08-04-2012, 05:52 AM
You have to have a MAP sensor. Sometimes called a pressure sensor in diesels. If you want maximum gains you will have to lean the fuel delivery to match the volume of HHO you are injecting. Other wise you will have to control the amount of HHO for the stock setting and settle for smaller gains. Here is something that might help you. This might not be your engine but the sensors will be similar.

http://samgor.ucoz.ru/_ld/0/6_Prado_3.0D4-D.pdf

Costahho
08-04-2012, 01:40 PM
Thank you

Yes I have found that the turbo pressure sensor also measures the manifold absolute pressure.
I am planning on adding a potentiometer on the signal wire circuit and a resistor on the ground as per the instructions of a simple map enhancer on the fuelsaver site.
The way they say to adjust this to your car is to turn the pot until the idle is rough then slightly back off.??
I was going to try measuring the signal voltage normally then adding the hho while running and take a measurement , then adjusting the signal voltage with the pot until it reads the normal voltage while the hho gas is in there.. I was thinking this would be more accurate ...
Need to resource these electronic parts down here ..knew i should have hit up radio shack b4 i left the states!! lol

RustyLugNut
08-04-2012, 02:19 PM
You have to have a MAP sensor. Sometimes called a pressure sensor in diesels. If you want maximum gains you will have to lean the fuel delivery to match the volume of HHO you are injecting. Other wise you will have to control the amount of HHO for the stock setting and settle for smaller gains. Here is something that might help you. This might not be your engine but the sensors will be similar.

http://samgor.ucoz.ru/_ld/0/6_Prado_3.0D4-D.pdf

There is absolutely no need to play with your fuel delivery in a diesel. A diesel engine almost always runs lean.

The addition of HHO affects diesel combustion differently than in a spark ignited engine. The combustion theory is different. The HHO effects are different. The controlling mechanisms are different than in a spark ignited engine.

Costahho
08-06-2012, 01:22 AM
OK
I will try without the adjustment to the MAP and see how it goes ..if I dont achieve my gains I will throw together the MAP enchancer circuit at the ECU
then we will clearly have the answer

myoldyourgold
08-06-2012, 06:01 AM
There is absolutely no need to play with your fuel delivery in a diesel. A diesel engine almost always runs lean.

The addition of HHO affects diesel combustion differently than in a spark ignited engine. The combustion theory is different. The HHO effects are different. The controlling mechanisms are different than in a spark ignited engine.
Reply With Quote

Rusty, you are right and wrong. In my setup you can run much leaner and get much larger gains by leaning the diesel engine but this requires larger volumes of HHO and different amounts of HHO at different load ranges of the engine to get maximum gains. If you only have one given amount of HHO through all the ranges that is very small in most cases, if you consider the volume of air going through the engine, then you are right. Leaning would not be of much help and most likely loose HP resulting in lower fuel economy. One of the things HHO does to diesel engines with the small amounts is similar to what multiple injection does for the really efficient newer diesels. The newer VW has 5 injections in the compression stroke. I am not sure when the last injection is and it might be after top dead center. There is more than one way to skin this cat. It is amazing that these pre injections are raising the temperature of the air so with the final injection there is a better burn yet does not increase the engines operating temperature. It is obvious that when a diesel vehicle is under load like in first gear more HHO can be injected and when at highway speeds in top gear very little is needed. This is how my system works. The amount of leaning is small but adds up on commercial vehicles that run 24/7. I have leaned my Mercedes out and with the right set up results are, header temperatures are lower, there is more power and fuel economy is off the charts. When set up like that you can not run it without HHO!!! It is expensive to redo the pump when you want to make a change on mechanical injection systems like it has. It also requires other systems like water injection etc. This is where electronic injection has an advantage. You can just flip a switch and go form HHO to stock or make changes very easily. There is a lot more but I think you get the idea. The bottom line on the newer diesels that are so efficient is you have to be able to cut back on fuel, maintain HP, and keep the temperature down or you will not see significant gains. An old HHO user said many years ago, "cut back the diesel and replace it with HHO at the right ratio and you will be amazed". He is running 20 LPM in some of his big trucks and has been doing this for 4 or 5 years now. He is laughing all the way to the bank every year. I thank him for all the help he has given me. You can not do this with just messing with the MAP but need to take into consideration the IAT and CTS. All the sensors must be in agreement or you will see very small gains, none at all, worse mileage, or through a code. There are lots of new systems out there for diesels but I think most of them are smoke and mirrors.

RustyLugNut
08-06-2012, 10:59 AM
OK
I will try without the adjustment to the MAP and see how it goes ..if I dont achieve my gains I will throw together the MAP enchancer circuit at the ECU
then we will clearly have the answer

But you will not have THE answer. Without a deeper understanding of what you are doing, you will get A result, but not necessarily the result you seek.

I am simply trying to keep you from wasting your time and resources pursuing a method I know does not work and has little bearing on diesel engines with HHO.

Madsceintist
08-06-2012, 01:53 PM
Go ahead and experiment, just don't short out the ecu! Report back with YOUR results. Good luck to all whom choose to seek knowledge !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By the way seek your help from those who have hands on experience with daily driven vehicles of their own that are diesel.

RustyLugNut
08-06-2012, 03:10 PM
Rusty, you are right and wrong. In my setup you can run much leaner and get much larger gains by leaning the diesel engine but this requires larger volumes of HHO and different amounts of HHO at different load ranges of the engine to get maximum gains. If you only have one given amount of HHO through all the ranges that is very small in most cases, if you consider the volume of air going through the engine, then you are right. Leaning would not be of much help and most likely loose HP resulting in lower fuel economy. One of the things HHO does to diesel engines with the small amounts is similar to what multiple injection does for the really efficient newer diesels. The newer VW has 5 injections in the compression stroke. I am not sure when the last injection is and it might be after top dead center. There is more than one way to skin this cat. It is amazing that these pre injections are raising the temperature of the air so with the final injection there is a better burn yet does not increase the engines operating temperature. It is obvious that when a diesel vehicle is under load like in first gear more HHO can be injected and when at highway speeds in top gear very little is needed. This is how my system works. The amount of leaning is small but adds up on commercial vehicles that run 24/7. I have leaned my Mercedes out and with the right set up results are, header temperatures are lower, there is more power and fuel economy is off the charts. When set up like that you can not run it without HHO!!! It is expensive to redo the pump when you want to make a change on mechanical injection systems like it has. It also requires other systems like water injection etc. This is where electronic injection has an advantage. You can just flip a switch and go form HHO to stock or make changes very easily. There is a lot more but I think you get the idea. The bottom line on the newer diesels that are so efficient is you have to be able to cut back on fuel, maintain HP, and keep the temperature down or you will not see significant gains. An old HHO user said many years ago, "cut back the diesel and replace it with HHO at the right ratio and you will be amazed". He is running 20 LPM in some of his big trucks and has been doing this for 4 or 5 years now. He is laughing all the way to the bank every year. I thank him for all the help he has given me. You can not do this with just messing with the MAP but need to take into consideration the IAT and CTS. All the sensors must be in agreement or you will see very small gains, none at all, worse mileage, or through a code. There are lots of new systems out there for diesels but I think most of them are smoke and mirrors.



This is a complex situation and your reply above just touches on it. Your quick discussion of multiple and pre-injection diesel systems shows your are just skimming tech articles.

As I have stated in other posts, pre-injection diesel systems benefit greatly from the addition of HHO because the mix of a sub ignitable dose of diesel becomes conditioned by the breakdown of HHO to reactive sub species and the partial thermal decomposition of the diesel occurs. The added release of Hydrogen approaches the classical studies which add 4% hydrogen and above. Once you delve deeply into those studies, you will realize the bottom line is HEAT RELEASE and the attendant increase in pressure. As you approach and surpass the 4% hydrogen volume in the combustion chamber, you will see that there is a delay between the injection point and heat release caused by the addition of hydrogen. The discussion of what occurs at the injection flame front is complex and lengthy and is better described via graphics and not text. But the bottom line is, the heat release delay needs to be dealt with via injection timing. Fool with your IAT, your CTS, your MAP or even your AARP, it doesn't help unless it addresses your timing.

Older Mercedes Benz Indirect Injection (ID) Diesels can still see significant gains with the addition of HHO even though it may be a mechanical or electro-mechanical injection pump (IP). Yes, I cheat by re-machining the IP mounting collar to accept an electro-mechanical actuator that allows me to add or subtract from the standard mechanical advance. This along with a variable output HHO unit provides control over most of the light load and cruise load ranges in which we drive and derive our most useful efficiency gains. I use the simple and common 16F84 Micro-controller as my core and use a simple 3D map to process the input of air flow (rpm), load request (resistive wire wound element as a throttle position sensor) and boost pressure to adjust in simple step wise fashion, the timing and HHO flow. Depending where in the map you find yourself, we have measured efficiency gains of as little as 7%( full throttle) and as much as 80% ( just off idle, throttle tip in) using Brake Specific Fuel Consumption as our measure (BSFC).

Even highly efficient modern 3, 5 and 7 injection pulse hi-pressure common rail direct injection (DI) diesels can see as much as 30% decrease in BSFC at specific map points with the addition of HHO and injection timing being the only variable change. At least this is the case with the Mercedes Trucks we have tested on.

20 standard liters per minute (SLPM) applied to a 14 Liter Class 8 Diesel does net efficiency returns. That is a small amount of HHO in comparison to the engine air flow needs. But it shows you the advantage diesels have in utilizing Hydrogen augmentation. If you can create the same conditions in a spark ignited gasoline engine, you can see tremendous gains. This also hints on how simple Smack Type generators can produce significant gains while complex mutli-plate generators can see little to none.

Oh, and just a quick question on your Mercedes Benz Diesel. What year is it. What model, engine and what IP model? And HOW did you LEAN it?

Madsceintist
08-06-2012, 06:13 PM
SO much could be said here, but I'll stick to quick and simple. :cool:

Timing will be your best alternative for gains, but of course I'm not into trying to "fool" the computer when you can let it work with you. Diesel is not the same as gasoline, this is for sure, but there are many of the same characteristics with compression and HHO. If it gets to complicated to handle with the fine details just keep it simple in your head. Look for the easy explanations that work.

Costahho
08-07-2012, 01:59 AM
I am only running an 11 plate dry cell which puts out 1.5 -2 lpm at about 15 amps, the 1kz-te engine is only a 4 cyl.
I am really hoping to see some gains without getting into changing the timing or the other mentioned sensors..thats where it gets over my head..install and wiring cell ok , trick out the ecu with map enhancer circuit..ok, but it sounds like it can get alot more technical for me ...
I should be up and running in a few days ..will post results once I know whats going on ...

RustyLugNut
08-07-2012, 04:26 AM
I am only running an 11 plate dry cell which puts out 1.5 -2 lpm at about 15 amps, the 1kz-te engine is only a 4 cyl.
I am really hoping to see some gains without getting into changing the timing or the other mentioned sensors..thats where it gets over my head..install and wiring cell ok , trick out the ecu with map enhancer circuit..ok, but it sounds like it can get alot more technical for me ...
I should be up and running in a few days ..will post results once I know whats going on ...

Good luck. It might be best to find the load range in which you spend most of your driving time and adjust the HHO flow to get results in that range. Your Egen (Electrolysis Generator) will need current control to vary output, but that is easier than fooling ECUs.

RustyLugNut
08-07-2012, 04:42 PM
Good luck. It might be best to find the load range in which you spend most of your driving time and adjust the HHO flow to get results in that range. Your Egen (Electrolysis Generator) will need current control to vary output, but that is easier than fooling ECUs.

If I may ask, what year and model is your Prado? What is the engine designation?

RustyLugNut
08-07-2012, 04:49 PM
Anymore information on your Mercedes Benz Diesel and how you manipulated your mechanical injection pump to lean your fuel mix?

How "off the charts" is your mileage increases?

It would be very informative if you created another parallel thread to this one to reveal and discuss your build.

myoldyourgold
08-07-2012, 07:06 PM
This is a complex situation and your reply above just touches on it. Your quick discussion of multiple and pre-injection diesel systems shows your are just skimming tech articles.

Well I have skimmed some articles but my comments were not intended to be an in depth technical dissertation on multiple pre-injection. I have had some hands on experience with a multi squirt VW that refused to do better than about 3% mileage gain no matter what until I went to electronics. That changed everything. It still is no where near the Mercedes or other diesels I have tested on. After all it was getting right at 50 miles per gallon to begin with which was very good. It was not cost effective either based on the amount of driving that was going to be done.

As I have stated in other posts, pre-injection diesel systems benefit greatly from the addition of HHO because the mix of a sub ignitable dose of diesel becomes conditioned by the breakdown of HHO to reactive sub species and the partial thermal decomposition of the diesel occurs.

The added release of Hydrogen approaches the classical studies which add 4% hydrogen and above.

Can you explain the process of "added release of Hydrogen"?

Once you delve deeply into those studies, you will realize the bottom line is HEAT RELEASE and the attendant increase in pressure. As you approach and surpass the 4% hydrogen volume in the combustion chamber, you will see that there is a delay between the injection point and heat release caused by the addition of hydrogen. The discussion of what occurs at the injection flame front is complex and lengthy and is better described via graphics and not text. But the bottom line is, the heat release delay needs to be dealt with via injection timing.

Can you give us an explanation of heat release delay. Cause and effect etc. I might be calling it something else.

Fool with your IAT, your CTS, your MAP or even your AARP, it doesn't help unless it addresses your timing.

In some cases the timing is retarded with adjusting the CTS and IAT. Has in every case I have tested on. Of course I have a limited test base. Just to make this clearer. The IAT and MAP have the most influence on timing. You can consider the IAT as a smaller increment adjustment and the MAP as a course adjustment. Higher temps retard ignition timing. More load retards ignition.

Older Mercedes Benz Indirect Injection (ID) Diesels can still see significant gains with the addition of HHO even though it may be a mechanical or electro-mechanical injection pump (IP). Yes,

I cheat by re-machining the IP mounting collar to accept an electro-mechanical actuator that allows me to add or subtract from the standard mechanical advance.

I would be interested in this process. What electro-mechanical actuator do you use? Would love to see some pictures. I do not call that cheating but using your head!!

This along with a variable output HHO unit provides control over most of the light load and cruise load ranges in which we drive and derive our most useful efficiency gains.

This is good. I use the MAP/Pressure sensor to control volume. I will be adding a sensor on vehicles with mechanical injection . Tested this with a mechanical set up which worked and got me going on a new controller.


I use the simple and common 16F84 Micro-controller as my core and use a simple 3D map to process the input of air flow (rpm), load request (resistive wire wound element as a throttle position sensor) and boost pressure to adjust in simple step wise fashion, the timing and HHO flow. Depending where in the map you find yourself, we have measured efficiency gains of as little as 7%( full throttle) and as much as 80% ( just off idle, throttle tip in) using Brake Specific Fuel Consumption as our measure (BSFC).

Even highly efficient modern 3, 5 and 7 injection pulse hi-pressure common rail direct injection (DI) diesels can see as much as 30% decrease in BSFC at specific map points with the addition of HHO and injection timing being the only variable change. At least this is the case with the Mercedes Trucks we have tested on.

This is very good for just HHO. Are you happy with 30% which could be only 2.5 MPG gain, give or take some on most 12-15 liter diesels.

20 standard liters per minute (SLPM) applied to a 14 Liter Class 8 Diesel does net efficiency returns. That is a small amount of HHO in comparison to the engine air flow needs. But it shows you the advantage diesels have in utilizing Hydrogen augmentation. If you can create the same conditions in a spark ignited gasoline engine, you can see tremendous gains. This also hints on how simple Smack Type generators can produce significant gains while complex mutli-plate generators can see little to none.

Oh, and just a quick question on your Mercedes Benz Diesel. What year is it. What model, engine and what IP model? And HOW did you LEAN it?


1984 Mercedes 300SD. OM617 The best of the old Mercedes at least in California. After this year more smog junk to deal with. Water injection, negative ion generator, HHO and a number of other proprietary things. I send the Bosh pump to India to be worked on by a friend of mine that has the equipment and does this as a local business. I only have to pay for shipping but lucky for me it has been sent back and forth with people that are traveling. I have had it done 9 times over the past 15 years to get it in the sweet spot, matching the HHO I am injecting. We are working on a project together so the amount of reduction is proprietary for now. It is so tied to the volume of HHO being injected, and all the other modifications that have nothing to do with HHO, that it would make no sense by itself. It will barely pull its own weight without HHO and the other enhancements. Injection timing is retarded but because I did not have access to a good diesel timing light when I set it up I can only guess at how much and so really have no idea because of the injector nozzle pressure being changed which also changes timing. The turbo is also cranked up a little. Retarded timing results in a lower peak firing pressure and temperature. It has to have the right amount of HHO to bring this back up or you will have a lot of smoke but very low NOX. LOL I do not use the drip method for timing. I now have access to a Snap-on diesel pulse adapter and the light to go with it. My 300SD has been retired for over a year now. The pump has been sent for a complete rebuild with a lot of new parts needed, not just fuel settings and I do not remember the model off hand. It has over 500,000 miles on it and started to give me some trouble. I am not sure what I am going to do with the car. It needs a lot of TLC on a lot of little things but has a strong engine and trans. I have been looking for a mint 240D or a 300D but they must have manual transmissions. I will try and duplicate things adding a new controller to do further development and for a daily driver. There is not many of these in the US and the 300D has to have been imported by someone. The ones I have found have been way to costly if they are in the condition I am looking for.

Costahho
08-08-2012, 01:42 AM
If I may ask, what year and model is your Prado? What is the engine designation?

It is the 2001 Toyota Landruiser Prado , full size suv , with the 1kz-te engine which is a 4cyl. turbo diesel

RustyLugNut
08-08-2012, 04:05 AM
It is the 2001 Toyota Landruiser Prado , full size suv , with the 1kz-te engine which is a 4cyl. turbo diesel

http://etoymag.free.fr/manuels2/1KZ-TE.pdf

I am doing my best to understand your vehicle and the possible applications of HHO and other fuel saving tech. I just need to make sure we are talking about the same thing.

Costahho
08-08-2012, 08:36 AM
http://etoymag.free.fr/manuels2/1KZ-TE.pdf

I am doing my best to understand your vehicle and the possible applications of HHO and other fuel saving tech. I just need to make sure we are talking about the same thing.

Yes
This is the only manual I have found available ..although it is for the right hand drive model and is showing the application in a hilux (4runner) but yes it is the same engine as in my model prado

RustyLugNut
08-10-2012, 07:05 PM
Costahho,

Can you log your driving, and note the rpm and speed range you spend most of your time driving in? It would help in clarifying the possible amount of HHO we might need to produce.

Thank you,

Costahho
08-11-2012, 01:38 AM
Yes
I drive about 500 km per tank of fuel (77 ltr) ..which comes out to about 6-7 km /liter or roughly about 14-15 mpg . That is all mostly back and forth to town , half off road (no 4wd ) , driving in the 1500rpm- 2000rpm range max, 60 kph , never make it above 80kph,winding hilly roads , i really dont ever get to do hiway type driving unless i go out to the coast and wanna drive north or south from there but rarely do that. 500km/tank is what i have based my regular figures on from what i regularly drive.
The 1 time i did do the highway drive my km per tank went up obviously but like i said its mostly up n down mountainous roads really never pushing it past 60 kph or2000 rpm

Costahho
08-16-2012, 01:12 AM
So I am all installed and ready to start logging my kilometers.
I am using an 11 plate cell from hho2u.com , I am running an ogo 30amp pwm and find I am drawing roughly 18-20 amps with a 3oz koh to 34oz distilled water mix. (with pwm cranked all the way up)
I have installed a dry scrubber with a moisture trap directly after the res. and then a one way valve that i found from a yoga ball pump that fits the 3/8 tubing perfect, this I am hoping will keep any water from my next bubbler out of the koh res, as i found with out this check valve my bubbler water was going back up the line toward the res when the car was off.
I am going to be constantly checking my bubbler for koh contamination as my engine has an aluminum head and i cant afford to eat it up with koh.
I have read other threads about a 2nd bubbler with distilled and vinegar but it seems there are mixed opinions of that and figured i would try the dry scrub then the bubbler first. I also added a few drops of anti foam spa stuff to stop the foam and it works.
I am going to log driving and see what i get ...hopefully i dont have to trick out the ECU but we will see
Any input appriciated!!

Costahho
08-29-2012, 01:33 AM
Well after running my setup for the last full tank of fuel i have exactly the same fuel economy...
I am going to try the MAP setup and see what happens from there

myoldyourgold
08-29-2012, 06:34 AM
Dealing with just the MAP alone might not be the answer. It is possible that it will help by limiting the amount of fuel to match the amount of HHO you are injecting to your average driving but you might be injecting to much and in that case you will make it worse. I would suggest you adjust the HHO to match the fuel you are injecting stock first. If there is no gain and no difference in performance then the HHO you are injecting is either to much or to little. Do you feel any difference in performance? It is easier to reduce the volume of HHO you are injecting thus using less HP to generate it so would suggest you start there first. When adjusting the MAP to lean out the fuel it usually requires larger quantities of HHO to make things work properly that might be difficult for you to do efficienty.

whear
08-29-2012, 05:20 PM
You have to keep in mind that your reactor has 4 neutrals per stack. That, from the get go, makes it less efficient than 5 or 6 neutrals.

How much HHO are you producing at 18-20 Amps ?

I think you should rather focus on improving the efficiency of the reactor. If you're running inefficient, no matter how much you try to adjust your electronics, the reactor's inefficiency will pull you backwards.

If I were you, I would dismember the reactor in order to properly clean the plates. I would even go all the way to insulating all the holes with Weld-On ( if the plates have been sandblasted, if not, I'd sandblast them first ). Then I would make a 1 stack reactor with 6 neutrals ( that means 8 plates in total ), instead of what you have, 2 stacks with 4 neutrals each.

Then I would condition the reactor. That means running it at low current for a few days, or how long it is necessary. I'd want to get rid of all the contaminants until the solution is clear.

It may sound like a long, tedious work, but it's necessary if you want an efficient reactor. Unfortunately, suppliers on the internet don't take all these essential steps to make efficient reactors.


Good luck

myoldyourgold
08-30-2012, 05:17 AM
Well stated Whear. This is why I asked if he felt any difference in the performance. Efficiency is key when there is no gain at all or to maximize the gain. 4 neutrals just does not cut it but are sold all over the place. Lots more one could say about the efficiency of that particular reactor too. The bottom line is a ratio of Fuel to HHO to HP required to make the HHO. When you get that in perfect balance you get the best gains. To find that point is not that easy though and can be achieved in many different ways with varying results.

RustyLugNut
08-30-2012, 08:30 AM
Well after running my setup for the last full tank of fuel i have exactly the same fuel economy...
I am going to try the MAP setup and see what happens from there

This is the unfortunate truth about HHO at this time. It is a CRUDE add on technology. That is why there is such variability in performance. But, you can keep learning and working at it.

koya1893
08-30-2012, 02:02 PM
So I am all installed and ready to start logging my kilometers.
I am using an 11 plate cell from hho2u.com , I am running an ogo 30amp pwm and find I am drawing roughly 18-20 amps with a 3oz koh to 34oz distilled water mix. (with pwm cranked all the way up)
I have installed a dry scrubber with a moisture trap directly after the res. and then a one way valve that i found from a yoga ball pump that fits the 3/8 tubing perfect, this I am hoping will keep any water from my next bubbler out of the koh res, as i found with out this check valve my bubbler water was going back up the line toward the res when the car was off.
I am going to be constantly checking my bubbler for koh contamination as my engine has an aluminum head and i cant afford to eat it up with koh.
I have read other threads about a 2nd bubbler with distilled and vinegar but it seems there are mixed opinions of that and figured i would try the dry scrub then the bubbler first. I also added a few drops of anti foam spa stuff to stop the foam and it works.
I am going to log driving and see what i get ...hopefully i dont have to trick out the ECU but we will see
Any input appriciated!!

I hope you did not pay a lot of money for those units, as stated you need to take them apart and re-configure them. I am using this configuration with much success: +NNNNN-NNNNN+ . the Neg does not have any holes, with 6 gal reservior. I've been testing a unit with a larger capacity resevoir, for some reason which I cannot explain but someone in here smarter than I can. it is producing better and more HHO. My 2012 3500 Ram was getting 17.8 mpg during my to and from work (a lot of stop and go 45 mph), now it is getting 21.4mpg after I switched from dual reservior (2.5 gal capacity) to a one reservoir to a 6 gal capacity. Oh yeah, it is in a truck toolbox shielded from the heat.

One more thing, those units you have I tested years ago. Now I use the plates to make washers/bracket for my installs.

RustyLugNut
10-05-2012, 08:07 AM
No matter what the others are saying, there is still value in your system. Keep at it.

nana0665
01-14-2013, 12:47 AM
I read this post from top to bottom. Very useful before getting on with an installation and cutting wires...

I am about to fix an HHO generator to my 1Kz-TE Toyota Prado. I got the plates platinum coated as well. Reading this made me wonder whether it is a worthwhile change? I am getting about 7-8Km/l on city and 10 on highway at the moment.

What were the results after the installation?

The supplier who shipped it told me to insert the HHO tube before the turbo unit. My engine has a intercooler and I am a bit worried about a gas trap and a backfire of HHO residue.

Can anyone share experience on this?

Thanks