newby corner

hey guys, i'm new so i selfishly want everyone to conform to my needs.
but honestly i think it would be a good place for people to know where to start, introduce, ask redundant stupid questions without much fear of occasional flameups... not that i'm accusing anyone of anything, just a place to feel comfortable getting our feet wet, and a place to send those of us who may not know how much we don't know.
i'm having a hard time just figuring out what all the acronyms are, and then when i put all the letters together in the right sequence, i still don't have a clue what i'm looking at, or why someone needs one of those things or what it does. it would free up the other forums to have more streamlined discussions, and would mostlikely have several stickies of the most frequently asked questions. i think it would be a great service.
by the way i have a 2007 chevy aveo, and a small jelly jar hho generator, 9 1.25" ss washers +n-n+n-n+ to jelly jar bubbler, 1/4 tsp trisodiumphosphate and i'm drawing power from my fuse panel off my fuel pump i think. not sure of amp draw and all, i'm still just experimenting, first week commute to work with just hho no mods helped me jump from around 30 mpg to 35.6, i just installed defoulers to both my o2 sensors and i'm gonna see what that does.

question... can i bypass my maf by just plugging my hho line in after it?
thanks guys great place

jedi

Weeeeeeeeelcommmmeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee in this forum !!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hhojedi

hey guys, i'm new so i selfishly want everyone to conform to my needs.
but honestly i think it would be a good place for people to know where to start, introduce, ask redundant stupid questions without much fear of occasional flameups... not that i'm accusing anyone of anything, just a place to feel comfortable getting our feet wet, and a place to send those of us who may not know how much we don't know.
i'm having a hard time just figuring out what all the acronyms are, and then when i put all the letters together in the right sequence, i still don't have a clue what i'm looking at, or why someone needs one of those things or what it does. it would free up the other forums to have more streamlined discussions, and would mostlikely have several stickies of the most frequently asked questions. i think it would be a great service.
by the way i have a 2007 chevy aveo, and a small jelly jar hho generator, 9 1.25" ss washers +n-n+n-n+ to jelly jar bubbler, 1/4 tsp trisodiumphosphate and i'm drawing power from my fuse panel off my fuel pump i think. not sure of amp draw and all, i'm still just experimenting, first week commute to work with just hho no mods helped me jump from around 30 mpg to 35.6, i just installed defoulers to both my o2 sensors and i'm gonna see what that does.

question... can i bypass my maf by just plugging my hho line in after it?
thanks guys great place

jedi

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Here are some acronyms, but mostly emissions.
http://www.fuelsaver-mpg.com/hho-abreviations

Wet cells are pretty much a thing of the past because they waste too much current/energy and generate too much heat.

The best cells these days are "Dry Cells." Tons of information on this site, YouTube and Ebay. If you don't want to get scammed, I suggest you do a bunch of searches here and TONS of reading just to get up to speed.

Wet Cell vs. Dry Cell:
<iframe width="560" height="345" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/gQOxWXRsLB4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Just beware that many people will tout their own designs and try to sell you anything or even scam you. Educate yourself from the great minds here on hhoforums.com! You can even build your own dry cell. Good luck!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hhojedi

hey guys, i'm new so i selfishly want everyone to conform to my needs.
but honestly i think it would be a good place for people to know where to start, introduce, ask redundant stupid questions without much fear of occasional flameups... not that i'm accusing anyone of anything, just a place to feel comfortable getting our feet wet, and a place to send those of us who may not know how much we don't know.
i'm having a hard time just figuring out what all the acronyms are, and then when i put all the letters together in the right sequence, i still don't have a clue what i'm looking at, or why someone needs one of those things or what it does. it would free up the other forums to have more streamlined discussions, and would mostlikely have several stickies of the most frequently asked questions. i think it would be a great service.
by the way i have a 2007 chevy aveo, and a small jelly jar hho generator, 9 1.25" ss washers +n-n+n-n+ to jelly jar bubbler, 1/4 tsp trisodiumphosphate and i'm drawing power from my fuse panel off my fuel pump i think. not sure of amp draw and all, i'm still just experimenting, first week commute to work with just hho no mods helped me jump from around 30 mpg to 35.6, i just installed defoulers to both my o2 sensors and i'm gonna see what that does.

question... can i bypass my maf by just plugging my hho line in after it?
thanks guys great place

jedi

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I also think so.

Here are some more videos to watch. These should help get you up to speed.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/smm-XGHIN04" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/lDjyIvza6Yc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tp0i3RbtWsc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OmXHhVh_nkY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mike, first of all thanks a bunch for making the video. I would like to add a couple of things to take into consideration when building a dry cell like this one. First is hole or slot size is critical when trying to minimize current leakage. A good starting point for the inlets is 1/4" holes and 3/8" to 1/2" for gas outlets. This will get you close to the manafold pressure required to minimize the liquid portion of the elite from spilling over the top of each plate.

Now in order to use the weld-on 16 you must sandblast the plates so that it will stick. It gives the glue a better bonding surface. With that being said it is important that you glue around each hole as you mentioned. I like to start with bigger holes in my plates and glue them shut and re-drill through the glue. This will ensure that there won't be any exposed metal around the inside edges of the hole and will save time. It will also allow you to change the hole size with out having to drill the metal, only the glued hole. The next thing that must be done is glueing the opposing side of the next plate straight accross from the inlet hole.

Another thing that is important is duel power connections. One on either side of the plate. This will cut down on resistance. Location for these connection is important as well. The first connection should be furthest away and opposite side of the plate away from the inlet hole. The other should be located on the side of the inlet but as high on that side of the plate as possible.

Hope this helps. "D"

I am very new to all this however in watching the dry cell vs. wet cell i was wondering if you were making your own plates could you stagger the holes by say 1/4 inch horizontially so that there was not a hole going straight from the front to the back allowing the current to jump past the plates?

Actually you want to stagger them as far as possible to help with that.:)

Ok so stagger far apart. Then I was also watching another youtube video that mentioned a product called weld 16. It was a paint on acrylic. I was wondering about painting a small area the size of the plate right across from the hole so the current doesnt jump through the hole and from one plate to the one two over.

The use of Weldon-16 and everything else is covered in here.
Holes should be staggered as far apart as possible (as Gus stated), and should be as close to the gasket as possible. Coating the plates with Weldon-16 directly adjacent to the holes will help, but the holes themselves must also be coated. Before using the Weldon, the plates MUST be media blasted. Simple sanding won't do it.
Here's one of Larry's videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnOl9...yer_detailpage

a question! i filled two identical bottles with hho from the same gen, straight tap, 0 electrolytes at the same time. yet the one we detonated more than 24 hours after the first was noticeably more volatile then the first. with 6 people to view them both no one argued that fact.
we also filled a gal. jug to detonate, at a distance of 50 feet away, not only were we near deaf, the detonation caused 6 peoples clothing to be blown backwards to our chests. and the container was melted inward even though the fire ball was the size of a soccer ball!

while experimenting with using hho on the road i had a failure of my gen with a leak, so as the water was slowly going down with me unaware of it. i went from a 55 mph zone to 70 mph zone in a hurry, but my driving doesn't consider speed limits so i went to 85 to cruise at. well when i got to 85 i let off the pedal to even out there, but instead the car kept accelerating until i hit 105 mph(insane yes but light traffic on a three lane), when i shut my hho gen off! the car began to slow back down as normal and i pulled over to see what my problem was, and found my gen practically melting. the water steaming out, the case cracked, and nearly no water in it. i initially thought the vacuum leak, but that was wrong, the car stopped the excessive accelerating when i shut down the gen!
i'm making amazing progress however, just need time.
the mileage we got while playing with the cars fuel system and the same unit i melted came to 129 mpg ! not average and not bull****, i wont tell how but it is true and i had a passenger. straight tap, 0 electrolytes, i've been a mechanic for 22 years, YOU MUST UNDERSTAND CARS, to manipulate them for this mileage, its extremely involved and most would not try it!

I thought I would post this video here for the newbies to take a look at. By sandblasting the plates, using this glue and off setting you inlet holes, your reactor will run cooler and MMW's will go up.

The reactor in the video ran all day today at 95 degrees at 32 amps. That is because this reactor blocks current leakage, putting that current to work making gas instead of heat. "D"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eLsNvPtxX8

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darrell

I thought I would post this video here for the newbies to take a look at. By sandblasting the plates, using this glue and off setting you inlet holes, your reactor will run cooler and MMW's will go up.

The reactor in the video ran all day today at 95 degrees at 32 amps. That is because this reactor blocks current leakage, putting that current to work making gas instead of heat. "D"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eLsNvPtxX8

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Great job Darrell!

Darrell good job indeed.

Darrell, you really did do lots of the good things. Makes for one sweet reactor!! One sweet setup setup and video. Excellent job as usual. You the MAN!!

The only thing I have reservations about is the bolts thru the plates. I use 3/4" gaskets all the way around to avoid any leaking. I also made sure that clamping pressure tight and hand cut all the springs to keep the tension high when the reactor cools. I just made some mods to the outlet fittings and the fittings on the tank Yesterday. I noticed they were to constrictive by watching the flow. So rather going to a bigger fittings I drill the inside out to 3/8".

I think there maybe more small tweeks that could be done to improve it even more. "D"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqvaaw2BjJs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darrell

I thought I would post this video here for the newbies to take a look at. By sandblasting the plates, using this glue and off setting you inlet holes, your reactor will run cooler and MMW's will go up.

The reactor in the video ran all day today at 95 degrees at 32 amps. That is because this reactor blocks current leakage, putting that current to work making gas instead of heat. "D"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eLsNvPtxX8

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Fantastic. Clear and easy to follow. Nice looking set-up.

Hello i am glad to be here.
Today i make my first dry cell but i make a mistake in plates configuration
-nnnnn+nnn-.
Can i make a try with this or is something goes wrong ?
(is that safe to give a chance only to see how it works before make it right?)

sorry for my english

thanks to anybody

Hi folks my name is Bob,I'm a little over 21,from Scotland and new to this forum and HHO in general.

What I'm not new to is modifying cars.Not in the modern 'fast n furious' big bodykits and flash way but in the genuine old school backyard diy way.

My car I was legal to drive was a '78 Ford Fiesta 1.1L which I dropped a 1300 engine in with a 1600 head,exhaust manifold from an XR2,a hybrid Escort/XR2 carb hooked up to 950 box and XR2 suspension and brakes.Take anything upto 75mph but pretty useless afterwards.

Learnt my trade on Cortinas and Capris before getting into fuel injection with XR3i's,2.8i's and XR4x4's.

The next step in my learning was to go Vauxhall (GM) with the Astra GTE and Cavalier SRi's with LE-jetronic fuel injection moving to Motronic later on.I got a Cavalier 2.0 16v SRi with the Ecotec motor with Simtec management system that opened up a whole new world to me.I ended up slotting a home modified/ported Redtop 16v running twin 45 dcoe's with a hybrid jetronic ignition.

In the past 8 years I've gone from a 2WD Sapphire Cosworth,to a Sapphire with a 1.8 CVH,a Nissan 200SX,Primera 2.0 Egt,Laguna 1.8,various Subarus and now have an Avensis 1.8 vvti.

Anyway that potted and greatly edited history hopefully shows I've got some modifying background so wont be coming to this completely wet behind the ears.lol.

Having said that I'd looked into running your car on water stuff you find online but never really went further than mild interest.I only came across HHO a week or two ago.

I read a thread in a non-auto related forum where the poster described his on going project of converting his pick up to HHO,the thread was over a year old and he related his attempts,successes,failures and what he was learning along the way.

Needless to say he got a lot of flak ranging from the doubtful,the science student who said it defies physics to real abuse but the more the tried to shoot him down he just kept explaining things.

This thread went on for 20 pages and I read it all starting off as the old skeptic but more he explained the more I saw that not only what he said was theoretically sound it struck a chord with this old school tuner.

I've researched the principles,theory and basics now I'm itching to try and make it work.

As I say I'm freshly converted and still coming to grips with the practicalities so please bear with me.

Bob

I am one of those who come from the anti over-unity camp. I'm just warning you ahead of time.

But, I know HHO works and can be applied beneficially. So have at it . . . join the effort and we hope you enjoy the process as much as we do.

Thanks but I wouldnt say I came over from the anti over unity camp as I never had a definite position on the debate.

When I read the pdf on converting your car to run on water I knew the theory was sound but the practical application seemed a real stretch.

Like I said it wasnt till I read that massive thread I gave it a second thought.

I've always known that hydrogen was an ideal fuel for the internal combustion engine (I did several years at college doing an engineering degree but circumstances put an end to it a year from the end but I do have good theoretical grounding toö) so the idea of feeding Browns into the intake to be aburnt with the regular fuel/air mix wasnt anything that didnt make senseg

In fact I remember running an old Escort diesel van that I injected with butane much like you would nitrous on a petrol.With a little experimenting with pressure and volume the effect on both power and fuel consumption was eye opening.

The whole notion of alternative fuel or a mix of fuels is nothing unusual at all to me.

When it came to hydrogen it always seemed a cruel irony that an ideal fuel,theoretically and potentially better than petrol was,i'd always heard and read incredibly expensive in energy terms to produce from water and I'd always imagined that it would need to be compressed and stored as a liquid under pressure in the cars tank.

That thread started as an interesting read but the more that fella told his experiences the more it thought about it objectively and contrary to what the önline science geeks and anti free energy lobby held up as science fact to shoot him down I seriously couldnt/cant find any good reason why it wouldnt work.

You don't need to convince me of the potential,i wouldnt be here otherwise.Nnw I just have to plan out exactly the type of system i'm going to use ??

The one thing I would say is I've not had my 02 Toyota Avensis for even a month.It's immaculate inside and out,has under 60,000 on the clock and looks,runs and drives like a 3 year old motor not 10.

I am loathe to use it as an experimental vehicle.Am gonna look for either a Vectra (Vauxhall/Opel/GM) cos I know those engines better than i know myself and rate them high or a Ford Sierra Sapphire with a 2000 pinto engine,great car n gutsy on fuel !!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RustyLugNut

But, I know HHO works and can be applied beneficially. So have at it . . . join the effort and we hope you enjoy the process as much as we do.

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That is more why I want to do this than the obvious benefits it could bring.

The challenge,the learning process,the fact it's sömething I made from scratch as opposed to bought and fitted on.

But thats what it's always enjoyed about modifying cars my own way and still is.

I remember raking around the scrapyard and stumbling on an MG Maestro so I ripped the twin Dellorto 40 DHCAs off,paid a fiver for them and set about trying to graft them on my XR2.

Had to cut,graft and weld up a one off manifold to fit them and it was a nightmare getting the jetting right but once on along with the Janspeed 4~2~1 manifold and system the thing was transformed.

The satisfaction I got from that one off mod was great and thats the sort of pleasure i'll get from this process,learning just what to do and what not to and refining and improving it.

Any insights I may glean I'll happily pass on to others !!