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Thread: How Do I Separate Hydrogen from Oxygen?

  1. #41
    Smith03Jetta Guest
    If you aren't intending to store each gas separately you can just put a diaphragm membrane on each side to separate the gasses. I'll provide more information on the membrane material as soon as my German friend and I work out some details.

  2. #42
    RMForbes Guest

    A Braver man than I

    While I am curious about your experiment, I am also frightened by the risk you are taking. Most of the designs that I have seen recommend a 5 psi cutoff switch so that the pressures do not build up in the electrolysis unit. I believe that the added oxygen has no effect on the remaining O2 at end of combustion. Air contains between 18% to 21% O2 depending on altitude and the additional O2 from your HHO unit will not increase that significantly. However, the hydrogen speeds up the combustion so the fuel is consumed before the end of combustion and the exhaust is cooler and more O2 rich. I don't believe that removing O2 will effect this at all. But I do not want to discourge anyone from experimenting. Just please be safe.

  3. #43
    h2gen Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by volomike View Post
    Now that many of us are producing ignitable HHO, I thought it might be worth our while to figure out how to separate the Hydrogen from the Oxygen, and then feed in just a dim amount of Oxygen back into the mix. This produces HHO again, but a far more powerful HHO. Comprende?

    Anyone got an idea on how to do this efficiently, cheaply, and as safe as possible? Sure, nothing is ever safe, but as safe as we can be here.

    For instance, and I'm going out on a limb here with probably the wrong assumption, but if you use a reverse osmosis filter membrane in the top of a box, and you shoot HHO into it at the bottom, I'm guessing here that perhaps the hydrogen will force its way through the filter into the top of the box, while the oxygen would be held back somewhat. And why? Well, hydrogen wants to shoot upwards, but oxygen is heavier. Sure, some oxygen might bleed through the membrane, but hydrogen will force its way through much harder. So, this might, and again I'm going out on a limb here, produce a richer HHO above the Dupont reverse osmosis membrane, often called an RO membrane. If this is true, then perhaps this is viable because these membranes are not that expensive.

    [EDIT: After doing some research, I found I'm not too far off my rocker here with RO membranes. RO membranes fall under the category of "polymeric membranes" and this European Union paper, published by researchers in the Netherlands, reflects on how effective they are. In the end, they said that polymeric membranes will work, but they suffer from swelling (and bursting) under extreme pressure, and that the hydrogen separation worked but was somewhat weak. The paper said that ceramic membranes were the best filters of hydrogen out of HHO gas.]
    You may be interested in this link:
    http://peoplesnewenergy.com/home

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    Auckland, New Zealand
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    45
    Quote Originally Posted by Q-Hack! View Post
    I wonder how a plain sheet of printer paper might work? Yes, it gets week when its wet, but you wont be moving it very much inside the electrolizer. You couldn't use NaOH with it as it would eat the paper, but maybe lemon juice or something as an electrolyte?
    There is a fabric that could be used to keep hydrogen & oxygen bubbles separate, or rather to prevent them from mixing as they're made on opposite sides of the space between two plates in a dry cell, but that will not break down in KOH (even at elevated temperatures) and will probably allow fluid flow to a small extent, and therefore current flow as the fluid can permeate the fabric - I'm not too sure about how permeable this fabric is to KOH, not having experimented on it, but it is a woven type fabric, so would probably work.
    this fabric is goretex, which is a Teflon fabric made by DuPont. It 's probably not too difficult to obtain (buy an old goretex raincoat for example).
    The dry cell would need to be designed so that there are separate vents for each of the two gases, not unlike an AlfaLaval plate heat exchanger in principle.

    Just food for thought...

    After a little more research found this link; http://www.youtube.com/user/myhydrog...16/V07eSsMslL0 . this design uses silk as a membrane - not sure how it would stand up to NaOH or KOH though.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    NorthEast Fla.
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    Drafty...
    I guess you might not have noticed, but it has been nearly 2-1/2 years since this thread had any activity before your response. I hope they still check in from time to time, because the goretex sounds like a good idea. I was going to use a double layer of heavy tightly woven dacron myself.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
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    1,418
    The gortex membrane might be of use but because it uses a chemical bond, it might not stand up to the base and continued heating and cooling (on and off) of the reactor. Rip stock(nylon) that has been treated to make it water proof has the same problem. The teflon itself is not the problem. I would like to know if anyone has tried it? Not cheap though. I researched it a few years ago and without going back and looking at my notes I passed it by for some reason so have not tried it myself. Maybe I missed something. The fact is, if H20 can get through then the gases can too unless the fiber can soak up the water and not really pass it through. This would not be possible with a teflon coating though. There are similar products out there since the patent has expired and could be worth a second look.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb."

    ONE Liter per minute per 10 amps which just isn't possible Ha Ha .

  7. #47
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    1

    two ways to do separation

    three chamber separator tow chemically treated membranes one that allows the hydrogen to bas through the heavier gas sinks to bottom of chamber. The lighter gas oxygen ascends to top of chamber through it's membrane. or use a wet cell double chamber production system that produces each gas separately.

    the negative side produces one gas the positive side produces other you can do it in a dry cell that has only three plates the center is solid stainless both sides have a hole at top and bottom making hydrogen on one sie oxygen on other but this yields low production even when you add a electromagnetic field to up production and add a resonance sound generator using a modern forlecent curlily cue light bulb and and ear but head phones you need to coil four inches on to get the resonator to work and it burns out quickly need the proper risister for long time use. you coil wire 3/4 way up on the dry cell one direction and reverse the wire in opposite direction to create magnetic field. leave the center absent for the electromagnetic coil.

    I have not been able to test resonator or the electromagnet coil much to up production but thought i put this info out their just wanted to explain the separation of the two gases. through either the membrane system or simply producing separately.

    To produce in a wet cell i included a document.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
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    you can do it in a dry cell that has only three plates the center is solid stainless both sides have a hole at top and bottom making hydrogen on one sie oxygen
    This is impossible. The center plate becomes a bipolar plate and produces gas on both sides.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb."

    ONE Liter per minute per 10 amps which just isn't possible Ha Ha .

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
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    http://m.youtube.com/results?q=elect...f%20water&sm=1 (my phone wont let me put it at the end)

    At the risk of resurrecting a dead thread everyone may have given up on id like to point out that electrolysis of water was originally used to seperate the hydrogen from the oxygen and proved the stoichiometry of water being 2 parts hydrogen to 1 part oxygen. it seems to me that improving on that design rather than reinventing the wheel? (Or the hydrogen bonb in this case) ill attach a youtube video to demonstrate.

    http://youtu.be/OTEX38bQ-2w
    .

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    27
    Please watch this video.
    I successfully separate hydrogen from oxygen.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2zA4rTTDOw

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