That would be one smokin' Honda.
That would be one smokin' Honda.
This is possible and is what is done for commercial hydrogen production but it requires higher energy input for a lower output. For our purposes of increasing fuel economy, I believe this would be conterproductive. Wiser people than I have concluded that the reason that HHO works is that it is not only adding fuel to the engine but it also increases the efficiency of the primary fuel combustion. Both H2 and O2 are factors in increasing this efficiency gain. The hydrogen ignites very quickly, up to 12 times faster than the primary fuel and as it burns it ignites the primary fuel from all sides at once. This causes a nearly simultaneous ignition of the primary fuel which allows for much faster more complete burn creating higher pressures and more power. But for this to work properly additional oxygen is needed to combust with both the hydrogen and primary fuel. Without this extra oxygen the hydrogen would consume some of O2 coming from the air intake to combust and would lower the O2 available for combusting the primary fuel and could actually lower the efficiency. Conversely, adding just more oxygen may increase the power output but not the efficiency, more fuel will be added by the engine control computer because it senses unburnt O2 in exhaust.
Last edited by RMForbes; 07-09-2008 at 11:32 PM.
So could you take that design and adjust the hydrogen to oxygen? Not just eliminating the oxygen available but adjusting it's supply to best suit your situation?
The problem with adding more O2 is that the cars ECU senses the extra oxygen and responds by increasing the fuel to the cylinder because it thinks its running lean. The best possible method to control this is by getting a special program for your ECU that compensates for the added "fuels". It could get expensive, but a performance shop that has a dyno tester could do this for you.
2006 Ram, 5.9 cummins HO. 4 cell design, 1.5 [email protected], 24.3 MPG
I'll have my h2 only gen done by the end of the week. I separated the anode and cathode with a fiberglass barrier. Then I ran separate outlets for o2 and h2.
I worked on this theory for about 3 very frustrating weeks, I finally realized that when you seperate the H from the O they both rise together. I ultimatly gave up and got drunk.
Life is an ongoing learning process, when we cease to learn we cease to exist.
IMHO, I don't think seperating the gases will trick the O2 sensors. You will still be getting a more complete burn and cleaner exhaust.
Putting pure O2 into your intake was covered in another thread. I believe it was determined that it would increase heat to a dangerous level.
I'm not saying it's not a good idea to seperate the gases, cause I don't know. The guy that reportedly runs his motorcycle off nothing but HHO does it with electromagnets, but he vents off his O2 and doesn't use it at all. He also has had to retard his timing.
It is now 12/23/08 and I have modified my opinion on this. I am beginning experiments on seperating the gasses to see what is possible.
Last edited by coffeeachiever; 12-24-2008 at 02:20 PM. Reason: new theory
Yes, the device you are proposing was invented by William Nicholson (1753-1815) - it's a good idea A better design is the filter-press electrolyzer invented in the early 1900's, it uses a porous diaphragm between steel plates that lets ions go through but not gas bubbles (usually asbestos cloth, which may be hard to find now).
What you can actually do is supply the air intake with hydrogen, and vent out the oxygen. The main advantage is that using H2 alone will not require you to buy an EFIE and mess around with the oxygen sensor in the electronic injection of your car.
If you were able to get 100% burn on the fuel, you would only see a few percentage points increase in horsepower. Engines are, by there very nature, inefficient beasts. All engines are different, but in general, 80% of the energy is lost as heat 20% goes to the wheels. If you increase the oxygen to burn all the fuel, you still need to account for heat loss. Using your numbers 100-21=79*.2=15.8% increase in horsepower. So, theoretically, a 100 horsepower engine would become a 115.8 horsepower engine.
Some days I get the sinking feeling that Orwell was an optimist!