Discouraged by 'NAY SAYERS'

[DaneDHorstead]

Stu;

I won't argue that there is more energy expended, freexing the entire contents of the freezer, vs. a single tray of water, soon to be come ice.

What I am saying, is that I have not touched the dial inside the freezer (as there also is no dial on the alternator), and the freezer does not shut off, when the tray of water, increases its mass, to become ice.

Intead, it continues to run, and fill a massive empty space, with sub freezing temperatures.

My point is not the amount of energy expended, as much as it is the useage of that energy, that is already commited.

And I note that you agree with the part that a freezer full of frozen foods will last much longer, in a power outage. But, it still will spoil if the outage is too long!

A voltage regulator, will in most cases adjust currents, the alternator puts out, however in my case (using the marine battery with both top and side post), I bypass the voltage regulator, using only a solenoid to route current to the generators breakers, and on through them, to ground.

You can validly argue that there is a cost to run, it, and I accept your argument!

But, you are already turning the alternator, so utilize it, to its fullest potential, rather than to waste it!

[Cadillac]

Roland Jacques, look at the NASA paper page 28, table IIL. It supports my claim that more energy is losed to the cooling system when lean operating with the addition of hydrogen. Unless you want to dispute NASA's results/test.

Now what I said in terms of circulating the coolant more is a guess. Not a uneducated guess though. In my particular car it is not a guess, I know this is what is occuring by test and observation.

I am not really sure what you point is on the alternator subject. I agreed with the orginal posting at the top of the first page. If you can effectively improve the lean operation range then yes you can use less gasoline to turn the alternator. Now the energy drawn from the car does equal what is used. What I am saying is that the gasoline is $4 a gallon. I never had to swipe my credit card on my car to get the alternator to turn so in that sense it is free.

I was not trying to knock RMForbes. I thought he made a very good post and very well written. I was however disputing that just because the exhaust was cooler did not mean that the car was taking full advantage of it. It was not increasing efficiency rather losing it somewhere else.

[sandman]

So then where does the gasoline come from to produce the electricity my alternator generates when my firebird is runing on HHO alone then?

Dont let the dickweeds and scientists get you down. If you build it it will run.

[HiTechRedNeck73]

look at it this way, if your hho device uses 12v @ 20amps... that's 240watts

most people have radios, amps, and speakers that use more than that...

run around for a week with out your radio on and see what your full economy looks like... you won't see much of a difference...

[tbhavsar]

look at it this way, if your hho device uses 12v @ 20amps... that's 240watts

most people have radios, amps, and speakers that use more than that...

run around for a week with out your radio on and see what your full economy looks like... you won't see much of a difference...

sounds logical; I agree.

[Roland Jacques]

look at it this way, if your hho device uses 12v @ 20amps... that's 240watts

most people have radios, amps, and speakers that use more than that...

run around for a week with out your radio on and see what your full economy looks like... you won't see much of a difference...

True enough. That is because 240watts only amounts to about 1 or 2% of fuel usage on some cars. Of course we would not notice this. But that does not mean its free, small yes, free no.

Even if it was "free energy", 240 watts (= 1 or 2% of gas energy) does not even come close to explaining our large gains. 30 plus% (without leaning). So using this “recouping the unused alternator energy” argument to explain how HHO Boosting works, makes no sense ether way you look at it.

The reaction (of HHO & gas) and the interaction ( of this Bi fuel in a ICE) are the only logical reasons explaining how boosting works. Mentioning the Alternator energy recouping is almost like mentioning a planes tire pressurewhen discussing how a 747 airplane can fly.

[Roland Jacques]

Cadilac, do you have a link to the nasa papper? I dont recall the heat part. I think we may be talking about two different things.

[DigitalMocking]

So then where does the gasoline come from to produce the electricity my alternator generates when my firebird is runing on HHO alone then?

Dont let the dickweeds and scientists get you down. If you build it it will run.

That's just what this movement needs, crackpots and scammers. Congratulations on clamping down a vacuum advance line. Good lord man.

[Scooterdog]

So then where does the gasoline come from to produce the electricity my alternator generates when my firebird is runing on HHO alone then?

Dont let the dickweeds and scientists get you down. If you build it it will run.

You would have to change a hell of alot to make your "firebird" run on hho alone. Seen a youtube vid of guys claiming to run an 8cyl engine on hho alone, but yet it ran on gas alone too? Simply F-N amazing!

Ya, don't listen to the educated people. If you needed heart surgery, I'm sure you'd have your buddy next door do the operation rather than someone with a degree that knows how not to kill you.

[hygear]

How much horsepower does an alternator pull ? You can mathematically determine the horsepower cost at any given load. (Remember, alternators respond to load. If there is no load present the alternator is basically freewheeling.)

Amps x Volts = Watts
Watts / 745.7 (one HP) = Electrical HP Produced by the Alternator
HP x 15% Efficiency Loss = HP Loss
HP + HP Loss = Total HP Used

Example:
57A x 14.9V = 849.3 Watts
849.3 Watts / 745.7 = 1.14 HP
1.14 HP x 15% = 0.17 HP
1.14 + 0.17 = 1.31 HP Total
Now we know the cost to run the electrical system. The most important question is what is the payback ? Which way does the horsepower benefit you ? How much horsepower are you currently losing because of low electrical system voltage ?