Surface Area and Voltage (7 plate config)

[TBill]

I've seen a lot discussed about the 7 plate config and voltage per plate. I've seen suggestions that plate voltage should be around 1.23 up to 2.33. My early thoughts on this is that a great deal of that delta comes from individual gen designs, leaks, material quality, electrolyte, etc.

So here is my question....
You voltage is 13.8 thus you plates are ~1.97v/p

If all other components are held constant (gap, material grade, electrolyte mix, etc) what is the effect of surface area on a given build? Think "1 gang" wall plate vs "2 gang". Or 4"x4" 316L vs 8"x8" 316L?

What happens? Where do you loss return?

[resago]

still to be determined.
in a 7 plate setup, there are 6 cell, so 13.8/6=2.3

[sheriffav8r]

It also depends on how far your gen is from your battery. Your alternator generally puts out 13.8-13.9v but there is a voltage drop depending on wire gauge and distance. Check out this site for some gouge on gauge :
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

[TBill]

still to be determined.
in a 7 plate setup, there are 6 cell, so 13.8/6=2.3

Understood, but most talk is "per plate" discussion vs "per cell"? (or maybe just from my perspective) I was discussing from a "per plate" perspective because I am asking about plate size impact to the use of energy.

Anyway, I'm really trying to understand "power". (This is really hard to communicate )

Try and tell me about the ENERGY in each plate (or cell) of a 4"x4" 316L 7 plate vs a 12"x12" 316L 7 plate. I understand that what I am feeding each plate/cell remains constant but what happens to that energy due to the size? It seems that optimal energy per square inch is a ratio that would be important?

[TBill]

It also depends on how far your gen is from your battery. Your alternator generally puts out 13.8-13.9v but there is a voltage drop depending on wire gauge and distance. Check out this site for some gouge on gauge :
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

Great link! Thanks. For this conversation, let's propose that there is 13.8 AT THE CELL. (Just to keep a constant)

[SpecHunter]

If you want to get that picky, divide your LPM into your cell surface area and do the same with your input voltage (divide into cell surface area)
Then compare with different cel configs /pwm`s/mafmap/o2 and log all the data and write a thesis on it. hehe
Make sure your not late accepting the nobel prize.

[TBill]

If you want to get that picky, divide your LPM into your cell surface area and do the same with your input voltage (divide into cell surface area)
Then compare with different cel configs /pwm`s/mafmap/o2 and log all the data and write a thesis on it. hehe
Make sure your not late accepting the nobel prize.

If I were a rich man........



Seriously, there is a great deal of conversation about plate configuration and count, but very little on optimal surface area / voltage. If the same plate count went from 4"x4" to 8"x8", you are essentially increasing surface area by 4x in the same config. What happens?

[sheriffav8r]

I don't know about the size issue. I'm going to start with 3.25"x7.5" and go from there. I've got 42 plates cut from 316SS .031" so we'll see what we get....

[SpecHunter]

If I were a rich man........



Seriously, there is a great deal of conversation about plate configuration and count, but very little on optimal surface area / voltage. If the same plate count went from 4"x4" to 8"x8", you are essentially increasing surface area by 4x in the same config. What happens?

hehe .. Your right.. I was jus having fun with ya...
There is alot of research to be done with hho. Both its generation and applications are fields to be closely watched in the next few yrs.
There are a few guys out there right now that are researching cells and their components in a moonlighting manor and using donations from ppl like me and you and posting their results via video clips on utube or their own private sights.
and yes ... if only we were all rich...

[Clipper]

For what it's worth, Patrick Kelly's d9 paper:

http://pesn.com/2007/09/29/9500450_B...r_Plans/d9.pdf

describes an area of 2-4 square inches per amp of current, and a plate gap of 3-5 mm.
(Page 3, paragraphs numbered 2 and 3)

I'm sure that there are a lot of opinions on the subject,
but these parameters at least gave me a "starting point" in designing my generator.