A standard gasoline engine relies on ignited fuel to explode and expand. This action pushs the pistons away from the head. I read that HHO fuel, when ignited, implodes. If this is true, then an engine could be designed to take advantage of the vacuum created be an HHO implosion. I also read that the speed that HHO gases implodes is much faster than gasoline vapor. This is why I think a HHO ONLY power vehicle may have to have it's timing adjusted to "Bottom Dead Center".
My understanding is that ignition timing for hho needs to be past TDC. Standard timing for a gas engine is 8* before TDC I believe. Most applications for HHO require retarding the spark to at least 8* past TDC.
My memory might fail me though. While pure Hydrogen and o2 is suposed to implode, air is usually added to an IC engine and the mixture explodes faster than gas thus the retarded spark.
google "a practical guide to 'free energy' devices" by Patrick J. Kelly
Chapter 10 discusses this.
It would figure that a mix of air, gasoline vapor and HHO would require a change to the timing to be most effective. I was considering running an IC engine ONLY on HHO(no air and no gasoline vapor).
8* past TDC is without gasoline vaper.
I don't know how only hydroxy without air could be moved through the engine without some major intake modifacations. Much simpler to use the present throttle body and introduce hho into the air going into the intake.
To my knowledge, none of the tried methods of using hho in common IC engines have utilized implosion.
I agree. I've built an HHO Generator for my vehicle, and the device draws more amps than is capable to be replenished by the process. However, what it does do properly is to give you back better fuel combustion that you normally waste out your tailpipe, especially as more ethanol is added to our fuels these days. And that's where the petrol + HHO works better, and has no problem replenishing the charge in the battery.Originally Posted by Stratous
Now, could this make a more fuel efficient petrol or propane or natural gas power generator for the home? Absolutely. It might make it twice as efficient.
Now, as for these engines that run on HHO alone, sure they do, but they drain from a battery for the electrolysis process. But that's not exactly a bad thing. That's a great thing. In a sense if you think about it you could make an "electric car" out of a regular car by removing the fuel, charging a battery at night on electricity very efficiently, and then letting that electricity perform the electrolysis that drives the standard type of engine on HHO.
Ive read a technical paper done by stan meyer which you can get on the web at http://waterpoweredcar.com/pdf.files..._Full_Data.pdf which goes through the expanding rate of hydrogen verses other fuels, timing, and a system which uses .5 amps. To my miminal experiance it seams that his research is very well thought out and complete.
You could also do heating, he wrote a very simple way to retrofit his device into an existing propane or natural gas furnace / water heater.
Hi all you experimenters:
I love all the pros and cons both ways, but is not water fuel what it is "fuel" not perpetual motion,The water is consumed even if slowly so no perpetual motion. Physics says perpetual motion is the development of power with NO input of energy (I think) if this were the case gasoline engines would be also in this class.
It comes down to one thing develop more HHO using less power, this is what we are all trying to do in different ways.
If we simply say it cannot be done, then lets all go and watch CSI or something, close all of the forums on the subject stick our head in the sand and watch someone else other than you get rich.
Of course it can be done we just have not been going at it in the right way eventually like has been said before "we have to keep on trying it will work".
DENNIS13030:
Your Idea about generation has been a thought of mine as well, I have an older toyota 4 litre diesel and 2 new 10 KW generators, in theory the engine can pull the two of them. I surmised plutting a cell or two to the engine and even if it did not run entirely on HHO it could reduce the amount of diesel used. I would plumb the radiator heat into the house in winter and outside in summer should be feasable? as the diesel injects fuel instead of spark ignition the additon of HHO should simply take the engine off idle, the thing idles for hours on a pint of fuel anyways with no HHO should be a fun project.
Here is a drawing of the idea.
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