Anti-Foaming Agent

[dennis13030]

The problem is not foam getting into the output line. The problem is HHO gas is STORED inside the foam and can not be put to good use.

Eventually the bubbles in the foam gather, burst and release some HHO gas. This situation means that from the time the unit is turned on to the time that you start getting usable HHO gas that there is a significant delay.

An anti-foaming agent might be able to minimize this delay.

[Phantom240]

Oh I see. My prototypes never really had a foaming problem... they've all produced in such a violent manner that the surface of the water was constantly moving lol.

[jerryrig]

The first cell I made that I was getting some real serious gas from had a lot of foam. Not at first, but after it tapered off, the foam would start, I lit some of the foam and BOOM! Man, it was loud. I kinda liked the foam.

[jimbo40]

That seems kind of like trying to get the trying to get the carbon dioxide out of the soda without having it in bubble form first.
If you were to stop the foam you would have to stop the gas from coming out of the water. Thats the transition point from a liquid to gas.
It's not so much that it's foam, it's that it's such a mass of bubbles that it appears as a foam and because they can't get out of each others way fast enough.
If they bother you, put the mesh up and pop them as the other guy said.
But it seems pointless to try to defeat the process we are trying to create.
If fact I happen to be looking for way's to create more bubbles/foam.
So when your experiments don't work, let us know so we can use them.
Seem like a waste of time to me but's thats just my opinion.

[dennis13030]

That seems kind of like trying to get the trying to get the carbon dioxide out of the soda without having it in bubble form first.
If you were to stop the foam you would have to stop the gas from coming out of the water. Thats the transition point from a liquid to gas.
It's not so much that it's foam, it's that it's such a mass of bubbles that it appears as a foam and because they can't get out of each others way fast enough.
If they bother you, put the mesh up and pop them as the other guy said.
But it seems pointless to try to defeat the process we are trying to create.
If fact I happen to be looking for way's to create more bubbles/foam.
So when your experiments don't work, let us know so we can use them.
Seem like a waste of time to me but's thats just my opinion.

I don't want to stop the bubbles, I just want the bubbles to burst as soon as they reach the water surface. I do not want the bubbles to "hang around" and collect. Also, the water turns to gas between the plates. Bubbles on the water surface is due to water tension. An antifoaming agent lowers the water tension and makes it more difficult for bubbles not to burst.

As it ends up, potassium hydroxide(KOH) is used commonly in surfactants. Surfactants are wetting agents that lower the surface tension of a liquid. It is the best chemical to use in a electrolyte mix. One of the really good things about KOH is that you only need a very small amount once. When you refill the tank with water, you do not need any more KOH because it says in the tank. The only down side to KOH is that it is caustic(it will rust metal). So over enough time, your electrodes will degrade and get thinner.

[cougar gt-e]

The only down side to KOH is that it is caustic(it will rust metal). So over enough time, your electrodes will degrade and get thinner.

Hmmm, The smack-ish cell I have foams like a banshee. The electrolyte is a mixture of NaOH and KOH (drain cleaner). Is there a foam producer in the cleaner crystals or what?

Only the outer plates are looking to be darkening and sadly only those plates seem to be generating bubbles. There are 5 N plates between.

[dennis13030]

Hmmm, The smack-ish cell I have foams like a banshee. The electrolyte is a mixture of NaOH and KOH (drain cleaner). Is there a foam producer in the cleaner crystals or what?

Only the outer plates are looking to be darkening and sadly only those plates seem to be generating bubbles. There are 5 N plates between.

I suggest two changes to your electrolyzer.

1) Remove one of the neutral plates and try it again. If you still do not get enough production, goto 3 neutral plates.
2) Use only KOH.

[HYDROTEKPRO]

ONE or TWO drops of regular diesel fuel in the electrolyte works great as an anti-foaming agent.

That's all you need. Just ONE or TWO drops!

It even has a lingering effect, so far in our testing, only one application per vessel is necessary. When the electrolyzer is emptied, rinsed, and refilled with new electrolyte, foaming is still gone. Even after a few dozen cycles like this!!

[mclaing]

Theres a good post on youtube that initially worked for me, use a kitchen spong that floats on the surface. It lets the bubbles thru faster. But since then I have paid attention to foaming. It's a result of impurities starting from your stainless steel plates. There are so many variants of the steel out there. I've made literally hundreds (I do installs) And when you have the right grade, absoblutly no foam, EVER! Second is the water used. Here in San Diego you don't need baking soda for tap water. It leaves a little gunk, mailnly brown rust. My best combination has been distilled water with 1/8 teaspoon baking soda, and I never have foam. Sometimes I make a cell thinking it's SS. (non magnetic, unstained, springy etc) and all it extracts is carbon dioxide or oxygen. This is seen when you light it and instead of a bang you get a mufffled woof. Then your steell has too much Chromiun(wrong spelling) in it, and will never produce the quantaties you want. It can however still aid in gas conservation due to the high oxygen/carbon D lavel. Also, the smaller your gap the less electrolyte. I use individual strands from a Cat5 cable roll as spacing. It's tight.

[1973dodger]

Dennis,

I have used both tums as well as a non-foaming agent used in hot tubs, The non foaming agent gives me the best results without any loss in amperage, about a teaspoon / gallon, no residue either. the tums did not hurt or help with foam or a quicker release of bubbles from what i could visually see. One thought though, Calcium on the table of elements for conductivity is very high, though is only rated 4 as an electrlyte in calcium hydroxide, I think it has to do with the solubility in solution, and tums are said to be full of calcium. Though calcium is not calcium hydroxide.

1973dodger