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Thread: vinegar or water wetter

  1. #1
    airdude Guest

    vinegar or water wetter

    I saw there is one company insisting on using water white vinegar only, but I also wonder about using a water wetting agent like this http://www.redlineoil.com/products_coolant.asp or that stuff used in dishwashers to prevent spotting. Helps water drape and move off glass without spotting. Any thoughts?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
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    145
    I've heard of people using vinegar... but I was told its not a good idea.

  3. #3
    volomike Guest
    In our very first experiment on Saturday, before we switched to baking soda, George (geonjim) and I here used a dillution of 50% filtered water, 50% vinegar with 1.5 cups in total of this solution. Our bubble rate was very slow, like one bubble almost every second.

    For me, potash is going to be our next experiment, and sounds like it has many beneficial factors versus the other favorite around here, lye (which can cause skin burns).

  4. #4
    jimbo40 Guest
    I use pure White distilled viniger in my Magdrive generator.
    It's 5% acidic and is deluted with distilled water, right from the bottle.
    As the solution is depleted I just add distilled water.
    It makes a lot of hydrogen, and it is very safe.
    I will be switching to potash (KOH) soon to check my output.

  5. #5
    dennis13030 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by airdude View Post
    I saw there is one company insisting on using water white vinegar only, but I also wonder about using a water wetting agent like this http://www.redlineoil.com/products_coolant.asp or that stuff used in dishwashers to prevent spotting. Helps water drape and move off glass without spotting. Any thoughts?
    A water wetting agent? Like something that lowers the surface tension of water?

    Potassium Hydroxide(KOH) also known as caustic potash is used as a SURFACTANT in many detergents. SURFACTANTS lower the surface tension of water! After doing a good deal of research over 3 months, I am certain that KOH is the best chemical to use in electrolyzers. You only need to add it to the water once. The electrolysis does not deplete the KOH. So when you refill the water in your tank, all you need to do is ensure that your new water is mixed well with the old electrolyte.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    Something to keep in mind... Vinegar has a much lower boiling point than water. I played around with it when I first started. It produces a poor volume of gas and heats up real quick.

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Distilled vinegar is good for the first time you use the plates, but not for the long term because of its boiling point. It will help to remove all the oils and dirt from the plates, especially if you have sanded plates. Think of it as hydrogen peroxide for a wound, it will not only bubble and bring the grime out of the small places, but it will also help to chemicaly loosen it up, too. Im not saying to use hydrogen peroxide though-just that vinegar as an electrolyte solution will assist in cleaning the plates, just as hydrogen peroxide will help in cleaning out a wound.
    "You don't always have to know ALL the answers, but you do need to know where to find them."

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by dennis13030 View Post
    A water wetting agent? Like something that lowers the surface tension of water?

    Potassium Hydroxide(KOH) also known as caustic potash is used as a SURFACTANT in many detergents. SURFACTANTS lower the surface tension of water! After doing a good deal of research over 3 months, I am certain that KOH is the best chemical to use in electrolyzers. You only need to add it to the water once. The electrolysis does not deplete the KOH. So when you refill the water in your tank, all you need to do is ensure that your new water is mixed well with the old electrolyte.
    How would you compare the concentration needed for KOH vs. baking soda?
    Give a man a match, and he’ll be warm for a minute, but set him on fire, and he’ll be warm for the rest of his life.

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  9. #9
    dennis13030 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by HHOhoper View Post
    How would you compare the concentration needed for KOH vs. baking soda?
    Electrolyte concentrations are beyond me right now. I would hope that the chemical to water percentage is very small(1% to 5%) no matter what chemicals are used.

  10. #10
    clarence1984 Guest

    hmm

    does anyone actually have any education with chemicals or electronics in this forum. I graduated from UAA with multiple certs in electronics engineering and chemical engineering I can tell you guys your way off from what is needed for this cell.
    If my patents were finished for my water car I'd display all the truth here but i can give some pointers here. Think about distilled water and regular tap water. Why does tap water work better?
    There is your solution

    please don't pollute our wonderful earth with cadmium and potassium, sodium hydroxide it's not worth your troubles and no major company or small company for that fact would ever be allowed to sell a cell that used these harsh chemicals that are not simple biodegradable chemicals.

    If you must use a chemical use sodium (good old salt) It's much safer than the others.

    Also on another note why isn't your cell producing well without the acid/electrolyte? It's because it's poorly designed. Rework your cells first then when it seems impossible to get more hho then use salt to improve.

    My cells simply don't use chemicals just plain tap water and right now i get 12mmw. It all comes down to so many factors. Use a cheap laptop or desktop to facilitate your studies you can get a scope and or spectrum analyzer along with a vom for your comp for about a hundred bucks on ebay.

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