Brand New project...alot of questions, help please!

[mobman]

Hey guys,

I am new to the whole HHO business but im planning on building a kit myself to use in my car. I had some questions before I dish out some $$$, hope you guys can be of any help.

1) I am seeing alot of "dry" HHO kits for sale on eBay, are they any better than the wet kits? Which one produces more HHO gas? Which one is better in an automotive application?
2) I am seeing alot of people talking about different amp levels etc. what really works and gives you the most gas production? More amps? more voltage? more frequency?? ::
3) How do EFIF chips work? What exactly do they do??
4) What type of materials for the generator work best? as in...Stainless steel/aluminum/titanium....what shape? Tubes? Sheets, mesh styles?
5) Any recommendations on containers?
6) Since we are going to be hooking up the "bubbler" to the intake, isnt the car's engine going to suck out the water from the bubbler into the engine??
7) What sort of pressures (in PSI) inside the container can be seen when the generator is powered up?
8) How about the heat issue? Anybody has a solution?

Thanks guys, I'd really appreciate your input and time.

[coffeeachiever]

You are correct sir, that's a lot of questions. There's a lot of help here though. I'll do the best I can with it and let others fill in the rest.

1. An open bath cell is just what it sounds like. The plates sit in an open bath of water and electrolyte and the current flows through the whole bath. Controlling amp draw is a serious problem with this design, but some here like VanHalen and MyToyotaSucks have had some success with it.
A dry cell contains the electrolyte within the cell/resevoir and circulates it to help control heat, which is your enemy. A dry cell is known to run cooler and when built well can run indefinitely without heat issues. It is typically more expensive to build. There are many designs of each and there is no answer to which one produces more gas.
2. You want to have approx 2.4 volts between each plate and keep amps down to a minimum. Amps=heat and heat is the enemy.
3. EFIEs add voltage to the signal from your O2 sensor to the fuel computer. HHO gives you cleaner emissions. Cleaner emissions make the O2 sensor detect more O2 and it makes the fuel computer think it's running too lean. EFIE prevents that.
4. Stainless steel is used at a minimum grade of 304 due to its corrosion resistance and resilience to the electrolyte. 316 is a better grade to use but it is more expensive. Do not use aluminum as it will degrade in electrolosis. I believe it also puts out some poisonous gas.
5. People use many different containers. I use thick wall PVC for my resevoir and bubbler. Just make sure that your container is resistant to your electrolyte.
6. The vaccum is not enough to suck the water from your bubbler into the intake. At least none that I've heard of. If someone knows of this happening, please correct me.
7. The psi depends on your system. I have not a clue what the typical ranges are, but I'd bet my wallet there are some here that do.
8. See number 2.

Hope this gets you going.

[mobman]

You are correct sir, that's a lot of questions. There's a lot of help here though. I'll do the best I can with it and let others fill in the rest.

1. An open bath cell is just what it sounds like. The plates sit in an open bath of water and electrolyte and the current flows through the whole bath. Controlling amp draw is a serious problem with this design, but some here like VanHalen and MyToyotaSucks have had some success with it.
A dry cell contains the electrolyte within the cell/resevoir and circulates it to help control heat, which is your enemy. A dry cell is known to run cooler and when built well can run indefinitely without heat issues. It is typically more expensive to build. There are many designs of each and there is no answer to which one produces more gas.
2. You want to have approx 2.4 volts between each plate and keep amps down to a minimum. Amps=heat and heat is the enemy.
3. EFIEs add voltage to the signal from your O2 sensor to the fuel computer. HHO gives you cleaner emissions. Cleaner emissions make the O2 sensor detect more O2 and it makes the fuel computer think it's running too lean. EFIE prevents that.
4. Stainless steel is used at a minimum grade of 304 due to its corrosion resistance and resilience to the electrolyte. 316 is a better grade to use but it is more expensive. Do not use aluminum as it will degrade in electrolosis. I believe it also puts out some poisonous gas.
5. People use many different containers. I use thick wall PVC for my resevoir and bubbler. Just make sure that your container is resistant to your electrolyte.
6. The vaccum is not enough to suck the water from your bubbler into the intake. At least none that I've heard of. If someone knows of this happening, please correct me.
7. The psi depends on your system. I have not a clue what the typical ranges are, but I'd bet my wallet there are some here that do.
8. See number 2.

Hope this gets you going.

Thanks Coffee, very helpful. I have a turbocharged volvo s40 1.9L but dont worry I found a way to have the turbo spool alot less, the intake vacumm with turbocharged cars are usually higher thatswhy I wanted to be sure about the bubbler. Ok so in conclusion would you recommend a bath type or dry generator with money not being an issue?

[coffeeachiever]

Dry cell is the way to go. Even those that are very good with wet cells still have some issues with heat and steam. Dry cells are more efficient and run cooler. Mine stays below 100 degrees.
I have made a couple of wet cells that made as much HHO as my dry cells, but my water would boil in less than an hour. If you want a wet cell, you should talk to VanHalen or MyToyataSucks to see how they do theirs.
MustangPro is going through the standard issues with his first wet cell, so his thread would be useful to you.
Once you grasp the fundamentals, take a few days and read Painless experiment and H2OPWR experiment for a bit more advanced study.
Most questions have already been addressed on this forum. A little reading here goes a very long way.

[Carolinablue]

Thanks Coffee, very helpful. I have a turbocharged volvo s40 1.9L but dont worry I found a way to have the turbo spool alot less, the intake vacumm with turbocharged cars are usually higher thatswhy I wanted to be sure about the bubbler. Ok so in conclusion would you recommend a bath type or dry generator with money not being an issue?

I'm not sure but I'd think spooling down your turbo would be defeating the purpose of using hho. You'd be lowering your hp thus increasing your fuel mileage. If your volvo is diesel, then you definitely want to inject the hho before the turbo and it my understanding that an efie is not needed for diesel. Been running one on my Dodge Cummins getting little over 2 lpm but haven't gotten any impressive results yet due to the cold weather and haven't really driven enough. Jan. I'll be heading to Florida so then I'll get some good figures.

[mobman]

I'm not sure but I'd think spooling down your turbo would be defeating the purpose of using hho. You'd be lowering your hp thus increasing your fuel mileage. If your volvo is diesel, then you definitely want to inject the hho before the turbo and it my understanding that an efie is not needed for diesel. Been running one on my Dodge Cummins getting little over 2 lpm but haven't gotten any impressive results yet due to the cold weather and haven't really driven enough. Jan. I'll be heading to Florida so then I'll get some good figures.

Well i was reading segrenes website (they make professional dry cells) and they say do not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE inject HHO in a turbocharged car as in "under high pressure" as this will create a hydrogen bomb. Because Compressed air under the turbocharger gets really hot (which is why they need intercoolers n such) so i was looking for ways to lower the boost otherwise I'd be blowing up my engine. I just want to see what kind of MPG gains I could get with HHO so lowering my HP temporarily isnt a big issue for me.

Btw. its a fuel injected volvo, not diesel.