Alternating polarity to dislodge gas

[myoldyourgold]

The information in this article should help in your thinking of the potential of electrolysis.

http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/44845

[RTJ_Nair]

Got this article and there is mention about parahydrogen and pulsed current cell enhancements.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...Lu_ggI6nf8xtfA

RTJ Nair

[Stevo]

E.G. http://www.robotpower.com/products/M...Plus_info.html

Building an Arduino based system right now using this shield.

[RTJ_Nair]

The BTN7971 seems to be a good half H-bridge. It can sustain high amperage too.

BTW, I have made the controller and have tried simulation by putting different values of capacitors in place of the cell. The inductor already has resistance and hence altogether forms an RLC circuit. The system identifies the resonance frequency and tracks it. I have coded it in such a way that when a change in cell parameters shifts the resonance frequency, the controller will find the new resonance and tracks it. Seems quite promising if all goes fine. I am yet to check this with a real cell.

Such multiple controllers can be put for each cell in a multi-cell arrangement and then independently tracked for resonance. The frequency sweep chosen is in the range between 2.7 & 20KHz. Stan Meyers has indicated resonance at about 5KHz for his cell.

RTJ Nair

[RTJ_Nair]

Forgot to add one more info.

I have added a current reversal for few milliseconds after each gating dutycycle period. This is as suggested by "painless" in the beginning of this thread.

".....My thought here is that when the polarity changed, the H and O molecules would then be attracted to the opposite electrode. If the switch was only for a few microseconds, this might effectively dislodge the molecules and start them on their way to the intake manifold......"

Note: (microseconds seems too small compared to a gating pulse of 2 secs
being the default I have set and hence have put milliseconds, ie few cycles in the backward direction).

RTJ Nair

[Hydrogenius]

Nice thread.

I've tried this before and I guess it worked but didn't help increase production.

Has anyone experienced this before? I used tap water with my electrodes in it and measured the voltage in the water using a multimeter and the voltage reading was zero.

I then powered up the electrodes and again measured the voltage in the water and I get some voltage reading very much lower than the voltage applied to the electrodes. Is there some stray electrons produced during the process?

[myoldyourgold]

When ever you change polarity on the plates it destroys the catalytic layer and will produce more para hydrogen than ortho. Of course that is assuming that you have conditioned the plates correctly so it had a catalytic layer to begin with. 90% of reactors are not conditioned correctly so will not make much difference at all.

Passivation forms a layer that has no known value in the electrolysis process. In fact it will raise the resistance of the plates. That is why in the cleaning process which destroys the natural passivation layer, removes chromium, iron and exposes more Molybdenum and Nickle on the surface preparing it for conditioning. Then in the conditioning process it forms a catalytic layer. By doing this you increase the quality of the gas and because of the lower resistance of the surface the amount made per amp as well. This is more evident in Unipolar reactors.

If you have a catalytic reactor and you reverse the polarity you will have to go through the cleaning and conditioning procedure all over again and without taking it apart and reblasting the plates it will not be as good the second time around.

[myoldyourgold]

There are many documents available on commercial passivation of stainless steel. Put simply it is the cleaning using either nitric acid or citric acid and then exposing the stainless steel to oxygen which starts a natural process of forming a thin "chemically inactive" layer of chromium oxide thus increasing the surface resistance but makes the stainless resistant to rust.

The cleaning and conditioning process uses NaOH and a controlled electrolysis to strip some of the iron and chromium from the surface exposing/leaving nickle and molybdenum. The conditioning still uses NaOH and a controlled electrolysis process which when done right forms a catalytic layer that promotes ortho and has a lower resistance. This catalytic layer composition is unknown to me but the results are. My guess is that the layer has something to do with molybdenum and might be a mixture of molybdenum and chromium oxide but I really do not know for sure and might not have any chromium oxide in it. It seems to be something that sodium hydroxide promotes.

[Hydrogenius]

I've used SS304 in my previous tests and I thought it was the best. There are cheaper and better materials out there.

[Stevo]

The way I have done this:

1) Use high concentration of NaOH (20%) and electrolyze in a well vented area until the plates stop producing iron/chromium oxide deposits. It will be obvious to you what this looks like once the water turns fairly dark. Also suggested to periodically drain and filter the electrolyte so that redeposition does not occur.

2) Rinse the plates with distilled water very well and then electrolyze in KOH (5-28%) solution. *I personally prefer closer to 5% as 28% is much more dangerous. At this point, you should probably be experiencing pretty clear water that will lightly yellow over time.

So the total cleansing and conditioning time, depending on your schedule, could vary wildly. 1-3 weeks or more.

I didn't believe that any sort of layer would be formed, but I was wrong. From what I remember; the anode will have a golden layer and the cathode will have a dark velvety layer.



And trust me; the golden layer does NOT come off without abrasion or chemicals like Hcl acid.