Voltage drop over cells?

[daveczrn]

Trying to put diffrent idea's in my head as to what will be my best chance at a higher efficency unit.

i have been looking at diffrent designs and doing alot of reading.

I've been reading that we really do want a pretty low cell voltage(<2v) so i am trying to figure out what will get me that low?

my question would be if i were to make a cell like +NNNNN- it would lower the cell voltage pretty low and should have pretty good output if everything else is correct right? A lower cell voltage will also allow for less heat coming from the cell right?

as well if i were to use the above design with a larger N plate than the +and - plates would it really matter? or does there need to be more surface area on the + and _ plates than the N plates?

I'm just trying to get alittle more technical than the average +- cell design.

[Stratous]

Trying to put diffrent idea's in my head as to what will be my best chance at a higher efficency unit.

i have been looking at diffrent designs and doing alot of reading.

I've been reading that we really do want a pretty low cell voltage(<2v) so i am trying to figure out what will get me that low?

my question would be if i were to make a cell like +NNNNN- it would lower the cell voltage pretty low and should have pretty good output if everything else is correct right? A lower cell voltage will also allow for less heat coming from the cell right?

as well if i were to use the above design with a larger N plate than the +and - plates would it really matter? or does there need to be more surface area on the + and _ plates than the N plates?

I'm just trying to get alittle more technical than the average +- cell design.

Using plates that are not connected to the power will help decrease voltage accross the cell. It will decrease production a little, but not a geat deal. It will also reduce amp draw and heat generation. If you really want to get the most bang for the buck, seal the edges of the plates on the sides. It will reduce leakage. Basically if forces the current to go through the plate rather than around it.

[dennis13030]

Some of the info that I have seen indicates that gas production and efficiency are INVERSELY related. This means that as you produce more gas by increasing the voltage(and current), you will be getting less efficiency.

DETAILS
If we took a single cell(no neutral plates) and raise the voltage across it starting at 0V we find the following;
1. At 1.229V, we start getting HHO gas production, gas production is at it's minimum and the efficiency is at it's maximum(120%).
2. At 1.55V, we are getting more HHO gas production and the efficiency is at (96%).
3. At 1.743V, we are getting more HHO gas production and the efficiency is at (85%).

See the attached image.

[daveczrn]

Using plates that are not connected to the power will help decrease voltage accross the cell. It will decrease production a little, but not a geat deal. It will also reduce amp draw and heat generation. If you really want to get the most bang for the buck, seal the edges of the plates on the sides. It will reduce leakage. Basically if forces the current to go through the plate rather than around it.

Intresting. I was wondering why i was seeing designs that are completely sealed. I didn't really think about what they were doing But it makes perfect sense. As well i don't have to worry about building a case to hold the cell. Do you know if the production reduces itself with every N plate that is not connected directly? like if there were this design +NNN- the center N makes less gas than the outer N's?

Some of the info that I have seen indicates that gas production and efficiency are INVERSELY related. This means that as you produce more gas by increasing the voltage(and current), you will be getting less efficiency.

So by what you just said you want a design that is low voltage and more surface area, so that it will produce more bubbles and keep the efficency higher. by doing this it will keep the heat down and the HHO production going at a resonable rate. am i correct?

[dennis13030]

So by what you just said you want a design that is low voltage and more surface area, so that it will produce more bubbles and keep the efficency higher. by doing this it will keep the heat down and the HHO production going at a resonable rate. am i correct?

That is correct. However, as I stated on another thread Energy Efficiency is NOT the most important thing. Cost Efficiency is. This means I may have to run my electrolyzer at 1.5V, 1.75V or 2.0V per cell. In my mind, it is better to use as much active surface area as possible.

[dennis13030]

One last thing,

An ELECTROLYZER contains one or more CELLS.
A CELL contains two or more ELECTRODES.
An ELECTRODE can be an ANODE, CATHODE or NEUTRAL.

We consider plates and tubes(cylinders) to be ELECTRODES frequently.
A conductive housing can be an ELECTRODE.

Anyways concerning the #plates and the #cells, lets say we have a standard plate configuration of +NNN-NNN+, there are 9 plates(ELECTRODES), this normally makes 8 cells. This is because the plates in the middle(NNN-NNN) are shared with the cell next to them. So the number of plates will always be 1 greater that the number of cells. Note: this excludes any spacing placed between adjacent cells.

[mikestrikes]

You guys are much smarter than me.........

[Stratous]

You guys are much smarter than me.........

I am not smart...lol. If I was smart, I would be driving a fuel efficient car instead of this 3/4 ton dodge truck. I also would have a good job instead of working for the Government...lol

[davar]

Stratous, What are you sealing the edges of the plates with.

[davar]

Has anyone tried putting the cathode on the outside -NNN+NNN- ?