Liquid Hydrogen MPG

[mobman]

How long is a while?

How many Watt-hours would be necessary?

How would you store it?


All of this energy, time, and volume to approximate a little gasoline.

I call this "Hydrogen Lay Away"


BoyntonStu

Stu...you are totally a non-conforming comformist. Your questions are not even worth answering since you are not asking the right questions. How long is a while?? That depends on how many amps you put into a system and how well the HHo system is build. HHO doesnt need to be stored...we are talking about an ON DEMAND system. HHO produced is used AT THE SAME RATE....whether for automotive applications, high temp torches etc. wikipedia is your best friend...type HHO and have fun with it. What is more important in all of this is...that HHO really works! The technology that we have today and will have in the future will make it even better.

[Roland Jacques]

Can I produce a pound of HHO? Of course I can as I am sure you also can. You asked a very open ended question, can you produce a pound of hydrogen in a minute, hour, week, year, compressed, non-compressed, liquefied?

HHO is NOT H2. Here is where we all need to change our outlook on things.

HHO gas contains 60,000 KJ/m3 of energy at 1 atm.

Hydrogen(H2) gas contains 10,000 KJ/m3 at 1 atm.

H2 is 1/6th the strength of HHO.

The article you refer to is based on H2 NOT HHO, so none of it is relevant.

Regardless I have done tons of mathematical equations and am of the firm belief that you can run a small 4 cylinder car at 60mph with 50LPM of only HHO or less with proper tuning of the engine. Im sure all the credibility that I didn't have just went out the window with that statement but I digress. Words are words and proof is proof, someday soon I hope

We dont use HHO in it's Pure HHO form. It is gets dilute with tons of air before we burn it, so its probably better looked at as H2 as far as its energy is concerned.

[mobman]

I have done tons of mathematical equations and am of the firm belief that you can run a small 4 cylinder car at 60mph with 50LPM of only HHO or less with proper tuning of the engine.

Yup...strap two 250+ AMP alternators and 3 deep cycle batteries in your car, some way to cool the generator(s) and get a stand alone Engine management system and you are all set!!

[mobman]

Just to add to this dicussion...I just found out that Hydrogen by itself is a poor fuel...

its stoich ratio is 34:1 but if you run it in a cars engine at that rate it will melt the internals...it gets extremely hot. If you run it crazy lean at say 90:1 it has no heating problems but you may experience loss of power.

So hydrogen by itself is a poor fuel. HHO = much better

[BoyntonStu]

Just to add to this dicussion...I just found out that Hydrogen by itself is a poor fuel...

its stoich ratio is 34:1 but if you run it in a cars engine at that rate it will melt the internals...it gets extremely hot. If you run it crazy lean at say 90:1 it has no heating problems but you may experience loss of power.

So hydrogen by itself is a poor fuel. HHO = much better

I disagree.

H2O is the ember of burnt Hydrogen.

2:1 is the correct ratio.

Adding more air or oxygen will add nothing to the burn.

At 20 MPG you use about 6.4 pounds of gasoline in 20 minutes at 60 MPH.

If you had 10 each 350 AMP alternators and a 500 plate cell, I doubt that you could produce a pound of HHO in 20 minutes.


BoyntonStu

[BoyntonStu]

350amps @ 12v = 4200watts * 10 = 42000watts @ 7mmw (with a cell like Larry's) = 294LPM I'd say you would be able to run a car on that......

Stu what is your point??

Why always post negative.... "you cant do it" type remarks. I would say most here are tired of it.

What engine will allow you to generate 42,000 Watts (56 HP) of energy and still run.

What size wire will you use to carry 3,500 Amps?

I say that you can't do it.

BTW How much does 294 LPM x 20 minutes HHO weigh?

BoyntonStu

[H2OPWR]

BMW seems to be having no issues running an ICE on liquid hydrogen. Running the car is no issue at all. In fact it has the same performance on Hydrogen as it does on gasoline. The problem is infrastructure for liquid Hydrogen. Costs are still too high because demand is too low. It could cost much less than gas if the proper generating stations and distribution networks were in place. BMW is also looking to get the hydrogen from electrolizers and not natural gas or methane. With advancements in technology and cell effeciency some day long into the future people could easily make their own fuel in their garage at night.

Larry

[BoyntonStu]

BMW seems to be having no issues running an ICE on liquid hydrogen. Running the car is no issue at all. In fact it has the same performance on Hydrogen as it does on gasoline. The problem is infrastructure for liquid Hydrogen. Costs are still too high because demand is too low. It could cost much less than gas if the proper generating stations and distribution networks were in place. BMW is also looking to get the hydrogen from electrolizers and not natural gas or methane. With advancements in technology and cell effeciency some day long into the future people could easily make their own fuel in their garage at night.

Larry

Larry,


"With advancements in technology and cell effeciency (sic) some day long into the future people could easily make their own fuel in their garage at night."

What MMW would be needed to produce a pound of HHO in 20 minutes?

BoyntonStu

[zennerx]

51LPM will make a pound of HHO in 20 minutes

7mmw = 7285.71 watts to make one pound in 20 minutes
8mmw = 6375 watts to make one pound in 20 minutes
9mmw = 5667 watts to make one pound in 20 minutes

I can keep going but I think you get the point. Now if you want to get technical, yes most of that pound is the oxygen content, but you asked for the numbers for HHO so there ya go. Yes, at the technologies current state it is not practical but it IS possible and will only get easier as things progress.

[H2OPWR]

Larry,


"With advancements in technology and cell effeciency (sic) some day long into the future people could easily make their own fuel in their garage at night."

What MMW would be needed to produce a pound of HHO in 20 minutes?

BoyntonStu

I am not sure about HHO but from what I can find 1 liter of hydrogen weighs
.1543 pounds. So it would take 6.48 liters of hydrogen to make a pound. only 50% of HHO is hydrogen so 13 liters of HHO to het 1 lb of hydrogen. As for the rest of your question. There is no answer because it depends on the input watts. I could have a 1 MMW cell and make 1 lb of hydrogen is 1 second if I hit the cell with enough watts. With my current set up I make a lb of hydrogen in well under 2 minutes. I simply do not get what point you are trying to make with this question.

Larry