new be to the site

[corvairbob]

i just found this site and i'm starting to go through it to see what the consensus is. i have a 97 saturn 1.9 auto. i got a system from greensource-ca and the vessel leaded like a sieve. it put more gas in the air than in the engine. i took it apart and removed the cover over the plates to let the fluid circulate better that helped. then i sealed it up so it doesn't leak into the air. the efie is hard to adjust and all the instructions were backwards, for my installation. they have no readout on the efie so i had to bring wires out and connect a voltmeter to it so can see the readings while i'm setting it up. i can't make the engine do anything when i trim the pot. i see the voltage move but the engine does nothing yet, except make my mileage continues to go down. the car without the hho get 27 mpg steady and now it is down to 25 mpg.

i tried a different pwm and efie from ebay and the pwm worked great but the efie made the engine stall. and when i measured the output voltage i got 12.5 going to the ecu. so that unit was junk. i tired both channels on that unit.

now maybe i can get real help on this site. my generator is putting out 5-8 amps and i understand that this may be the correct amount for a 1.9 engine maybe even a bit to much but with the other devices not working good and poor instructions i have no place to go. thanks maybe some one here can help. thanks bob p.

[koya1893]

i just found this site and i'm starting to go through it to see what the consensus is. i have a 97 saturn 1.9 auto. i got a system from greensource-ca and the vessel leaded like a sieve. it put more gas in the air than in the engine. i took it apart and removed the cover over the plates to let the fluid circulate better that helped. then i sealed it up so it doesn't leak into the air. the efie is hard to adjust and all the instructions were backwards, for my installation. they have no readout on the efie so i had to bring wires out and connect a voltmeter to it so can see the readings while i'm setting it up. i can't make the engine do anything when i trim the pot. i see the voltage move but the engine does nothing yet, except make my mileage continues to go down. the car without the hho get 27 mpg steady and now it is down to 25 mpg.

i tried a different pwm and efie from ebay and the pwm worked great but the efie made the engine stall. and when i measured the output voltage i got 12.5 going to the ecu. so that unit was junk. i tired both channels on that unit.

now maybe i can get real help on this site. my generator is putting out 5-8 amps and i understand that this may be the correct amount for a 1.9 engine maybe even a bit to much but with the other devices not working good and poor instructions i have no place to go. thanks maybe some one here can help. thanks bob p.

Bob,
First let me welcome you to the forum, second your cell or electrolyzer does not put out any amps. It consumes or uses it, also you need to post some photos. There's a lot of old guys in here including myself, we need photos to help. Additionally, need more info on the cell, configuration, how many "bipolar" or "N" and how many plates total. What are you using for electrolyte (NaOH or KOH). You can build a solid cell and not need a PWM and run it brute force. so give us the full story with pictures before we can start to help and hurry my connection is limited. Oh yeah that small eng will need at the min 1 LPM you can achieve that with a small cell or mid cell and not run it so hard. I am sure room is limited so small is probably your desire approach.
Ben

[corvairbob]

First let me welcome you to the forum, second your cell or electrolyzer does not put out any amps. It consumes or uses it, also you need to post some photos. There's a lot of old guys in here including myself, we need photos to help. Additionally, need more info on the cell, configuration, how many "bipolar" or "N" and how many plates total. What are you using for electrolyte (NaOH or KOH). You can build a solid cell and not need a PWM and run it brute force. so give us the full story with pictures before we can start to help and hurry my connection is limited. Oh yeah that small eng will need at the min 1 LPM you can achieve that with a small cell or mid cell and not run it so hard. I am sure room is limited so small is probably your desire approach.
Ben


ben i know the generator consumes power maybe i stated that wrong. my generator came from greensource-ca as a complete kit that they recommended for my engine size and they told me it can put out 3 lpm. and it is a stainless steel vessel. i don't know about the plates, and when i can figure out how to post some pictures i will get them out. i use koh for electrolite the cell now is using 5 amps i can get more but it is a starting point. i have the efie set at .15 volts now at .20 volts it make the engine stumble. maybe i need more but when i turn it off the 02 sensor looks to me to be showing .002 to .003 volts maybe someone can tell me where a good place to set the efie for a starting point. the efie can go from .002 all the way to .399 . the meter i uses i a dvm and i have it set at the 20 volt range. for now. the efie is not easy to adjust i have to be stopped and hold it in my hands it has no outside efie adjustments but it has an outside knob for the ccpwm.

thanks bob p.

if some can send along picture posting instructions that would be great. thanks

[koya1893]

I am not clear on the setting on your multi meter, then again I am limited on electrical subject also. If I am not mistaken your Saturn has "narrow band" oxygen sensors, one in front and one rear. The EFIE I work with are usually set at 350mv, I guess that would be .350 to your tester and 200mv for the rear.

If your cell is only using 5 amps, it is not making 3lpm. I'll give you my vintage "Bimmer" if that is posible to a system from Ebay. To make you the amount of HHO you need, even with your cell. At the min you need to see 10-15 amps, the only way to get that is from your mixture. since you are using KOH, start with 100mg per 1 qt of distilled water, which is basically equal to 1lb. to 1 gal of DW. By the way glad to hear that you cell has SS, if not get your money back. I would consider that anyway, but that just me.

To post photos you need to click on the "manage attachment" which is located below the response box, then just locate your attachment and follow the window from there.

[corvairbob]

I am not clear on the setting on your multi meter, then again I am limited on electrical subject also. If I am not mistaken your Saturn has "narrow band" oxygen sensors, one in front and one rear. The EFIE I work with are usually set at 350mv, I guess that would be .350 to your tester and 200mv for the rear.

If your cell is only using 5 amps, it is not making 3lpm. I'll give you my vintage "Bimmer" if that is posible to a system from Ebay. To make you the amount of HHO you need, even with your cell. At the min you need to see 10-15 amps, the only way to get that is from your mixture. since you are using KOH, start with 100mg per 1 qt of distilled water, which is basically equal to 1lb. to 1 gal of DW. By the way glad to hear that you cell has SS, if not get your money back. I would consider that anyway, but that just me.

To post photos you need to click on the "manage attachment" which is located below the response box, then just locate your attachment and follow the window from there.

yes i know it is not making 3 lpm at 5 amps but from what i have been tpls from the company i got it from i should start small and work up.

i started with 3 tbl spoons of koh per liter and had to reduce it. i was then instructed to go to a starting point of 1 tbl spoon of koh per liter. then work up from there. when i used 3 tbl spoons i was using up to 18 amps and they told me that was taxing the alternator.

here are the pictures starting with the unit off then progressing to the unit turned on. they only let me put 5 at a time so i will post multiple to get the rest. i have a video of the supply hose to the TB showing the bubbles. it dies put out a lot of bubbles but i have not yet put it into a setup to actually measure the volume.

i have not yet addressed the rear 02 sensor. they told me i did not have to deal with that one based on my car.

i have now set the efie to put out .400 on the 20 volt scale. = .400 mv i will start there and work my way beck down. if that fails and gives me problems then i may just give it up.

with the lower settings all i get is engine stumble and check engine lights and codes. most of the codes are p1133 one was p0300 which was multiple misfires. engine was taking those settings bad they were from .050 up to .200 then i just had to turn it off.

genrator off no amp draw,relay block top relay controls 02 sensor so when i turn it off this relay puts the 02 sensor back to original bottom relay turns on the generator,the digital efie that i have in use,scan gage no off because the engine is not running yet,dvm showing the setting i use,

[corvairbob]

more pictures of my system these are now after the engine was started.
tach, amp gage showing amp draw,scan gage showing some settings,dvm settings so you can see what number i'm telling you,top of the generator

[corvairbob]

more pictures of my system
show the hho hose with the fb arrester,shows where i have attached the outlet to the engine just before the TB.

i have a movie but it will not upload. that show the bubbles as they happen if someone needs to see them i can email it to you. thanks for the assistance. bob p.

[lhazleton]

Bob,
Welcome to the Forum!
Not to burst your bubble, but from the photo you posted what you have is a wet-cell design reactor. Very inefficient, to say the least. Sorry......

[Sodbuster]

Welcome aboard

[Madsceintist]

Just a couple things, not to upset you ..........

You should have thrown your washer bottle in the trash instead of cutting into you core support !!!!!!!!!

AND GET THAT HOSE AWAY FROM THE EXHAUST MANIFOLD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As well as the wiring since its not insulated or covered.

JUST SAYING ..............................

Not to keep up the down flow here but that check valve wont do what you intend. But you've got the right idea. Do a ton of reading and enjoy when you get the direction you need to be in down.